Looking for a laptop
 

<font color="plum">I've been giving a lot of thought to buying a laptop now that prices have come way down. My primary goal is to have a laptop that can handle NWN graphics and MMORPG play so my boys and I can actually party together. Second use will just be as a backup computer with internet access and data storage (word processing and spreadsheet documents).

Most machines I see seem to have the gaming capability I'm looking for as long as the graphics card can handle the load. My biggest concern is with Windows Vista. I've heard a lot of criticism about the software - then again, there was the same criticisms about XP when it came out. Is Vista as bad as they say? If so, is it possible to get a laptop with XP instead of Vista?

And as long as I'm asking, if anyone has a spare laptop they want to get rid of, I'll be glad to discuss that with you too. :D</font>

Re: Looking for a laptop
 

Sorry, I have not seen it. ;)

Re: Looking for a laptop
 

well if you already have XP that you're using then it doesn't really matter which computer you're going to buy (OS wise..vista / xp/ linux even though I doubt you'll find any of those ) Alot of programs are moving into vista support, so I don't think this argument holds that much water anymore. When vista came out initially, this was a big problem because alot of drivers didn't work on it. But that's mostly a thing of the past (unless you're using some product that completly stopped making new drivers, printers scanners etc). Vista is very..resource heavy (afaik) , because when I got my comp with 2 gigs ram and vista. It felt like XP with 512 mb (from which I had upgraded). But I downgraded to XP and its ZOOOM ZOOM fast :D (i guess that's a plus?) haha

Secondly - I'm not quite sure about the idea of using a laptop for Gaming (though there are gaming specific laptops that go for lots of moolah). Primary concern is, laptops heatup really fast (because most arn't meant for such heavy usage- which newer games require). Imagine playing a game and just when you hit a climatic point, your computer shuts down automatically. (yes this does happen) because laptops have a functionality that prevents them from going above a certain temprature.

But a plus (as small as it is) is that you can move around anywhere while playing it :D.

But I'm not trying to discourage you, I'm just letting you know that this is a concern that you should be aware of (because the over heated laptop can give serious burns ..on laps) I'm speaking from my own experience of playing MMOrpg on my laptop (now on desktop only!). So if you decide on buying laptops , make sure you get one with enough ventilation or get one of those cooling pads with it.

And speaking of the actual laptop, I'm pretty sure Gateway and dell carry gaming laptops at a reasonable price. (nevermind..they don't both of their gaming laptops are 3000+ lol)

Re: Looking for a laptop
 

Two thoughts...

First, with a laptop you are committed to the graphics card for life. Good graphics and long battery life are diametrically opposed, so the odds of getting both in the same machine are somewhere between slim and none.

Second, I've been running Vista for over a year on my work machine. If I could, I'd bust it back to XP in a heartbeat. Not that Vista is necessarily bad, but even a year later, I'm *still* running in to driver and compatibility issues... and there don't appear to be any real fixes on the horizon. Since this is my work machine, I don't play games on it, so I don't have any perspective for you there.

Re: Looking for a laptop
 

NWN is already old. Most laptops will easily handle that game, unless they too are old which in that case you don't want them anyways. Vista is okay, but compatibility issues still plague it. Obviously laptops aren't gaming rigs by design, but more so for word processing portability etc. but NWN should run alright on anything you buy now.

Re: Looking for a laptop
 

<font color="plum">Actual gaming time on the laptop would be very limited. The boys are with me every other weekend during school and every other week during summer. Of the three, only the oldest really plays NWN very much. I limit them to one hour per session, so I usually just do something else while he's playing. But it would be nice if we could party together OR one of his brothers could play on the laptop while he is on the PC (youngest one plays games off of cartoon network).

The other issue would be to still have decent internet access while the main PC is in use. I have a backup PC running Windows 98. It works, but is very slow. I also keep a daily log now and running documentation of various expenses. I have this data on the PC harddrive and a CD, but you can't have too many backups. :D

I would also like the ability to play NWN if *I* happen to travel somewhere.</font>

Re: Looking for a laptop
 

Once you have broadband, splitting the load between two systems shouldn't be an issue, given the non-demanding activities you mentioned. You'd essentially be having a LAN party anyways.

I agree, it is indeed nice to be able to MP with others, go for it as you all will have a blast together. You can jump from server to server, or start your own private server or even play one of the OC's in MPer. Plus, you could play NWN's anywhere even if it's offline.

Re: Looking for a laptop
 

If you're not looking for a powergaming machine, so much the better. Sounds like an "average" machine should be sufficient. Max out the memory, get the biggest hard drive you can, and life should be good.

If you're playing locally, then speed is dictated by your router/switch. If you're playing on the web, then divide your speed by the number of connected computers... roughly.

I found a CNET tool to check your bandwidth here. Mine clocked in at 745k... sufficient for my needs. You can see where yours is.

As for whoever gets stuck playing on the Win98 machine.... no good news there. ;) Since it's a backup, it probably hasn't had much done for performance... assuming you could find the parts today...

Re: Looking for a laptop
 

A laptop that can handle NWN wont be hard to find. Any stock comp with a 256mb graphic card will be easily enough. Still, as others have said try and keep it cool and get one with good airflow.

As For Vista.
I don't know what everyone's problem with Vista is, I think it's 1000 times better than XP ever was! I've built 2 comps with Vista now and have had only 1 yes 1 compatibility problem with a game and all it took was a quick file download. That’s a million times less problems than I've had with XP. Plus XP is being phased out anyway. XP lovers Criticize Vista because either they've heard something along the grapevine, Their computer cant run it properly so they are jealous or they are just scared of new and better things. All this “Vista isn’t compatible bla bla” crap is just that, crap! You will only find problems if you are trying to run it with something REALLY OLD.

BTW, NWN runs on my Vista. Just make sure you have the latest patch. i.e. click on 'Update' inside the game and it runs with less bugs and freezes than the XP version.

Re: Looking for a laptop
 

Bought 3 laptops in the last 7 years, all Macs, all great. First one was my main computer for 5 years and never broke down.

With bootcamp, you can have mac AND pc. Only bummer is the cost, but when you factor in all the software included, the Mac is better value for money.

I actually don't use a desktop still.

Re: Looking for a laptop
 

For perspective, I got my work laptop with Vista because I expected my customers to be moving to Vista, and needed to be able to address their environments. What I've found...

• HP drivers worked only partially until I stumbled across someone from Microsoft who was handing out drivers on the sly. Don't know if he still is or not... but I've got his email.
• Some of the applications used by my company don't run or install on Vista. Yeah, we need to upgrade them... but there's no value-added reason to do that yet.
• Vista's error messages are occasionally misleading... such as "you don't have permission to access this" really meaning "this is actually stored somewhere else, and you have to access it there". Protection by obfuscation is hallucination.
• Sales don't lie... there's a reason that MS has decided to sell XP until 2010, and support it until 2014... And yes, *officially* you can't buy XP any more... unless, of course, you buy it from a smaller retailer (Asus, others).

What many corporate people are saying is that if they move to Vista, the return involved across the corporation does not justify the investment required. IOW, they're paying a lot to get not much in return... not much boost in performance or reliability. Hence the corporate decisions to upgrade slowly... when forced... while anticipating a better alternative along the way.

Doesn't mean Vista is bad. It means that Vista isn't yet more valuable than the cost to upgrade to it.

Re: Looking for a laptop
 

And they said the same thing when XP first came out, yet win98 and 2000 died off in no time.

Re: Looking for a laptop
 

True enough. I'm only speaking from my experiences over the past year. You are obviously seeing something quite a bit different than I am. Although you forgot to include Windows NT in there... NT4 SP6A was nice and stable.

For individuals, the choice of OS is related to the relatively standard programs they run - games, browser, email, office.

For corporations, the choice of OS is related to other applications as well - finance, manufacturing, planning, storefront, and more. If those aren't compatible, it's not worth the effort to move up until the infrastructure supports it. Duplex printing didn't work on my HP printer for six months after Vista was out. For me, it was an inconvenience. For a company with 250 PCs and 25 printers, it would be much more than that.

And since Cerek's original question was about a (mostly) personal laptop, many of my points will simply go away... ;)

Re: Looking for a laptop
 

<i>*lurk mode off*</i>

Not really sure on what price range you're looking at (unless I missed that part) but if you want a gaming laptop then you don't want to go further than a Dell XPS. I currently use the 1730 with the 8800M GTX's running in SLI and 4gb of dual channel 667mhz ram. It does run Vista but like most have said, I'd get rid of it in a heartbeat however there aren't any major issues apart from transfer speeds for me.
As far as gaming, well this will pretty much do you for just about anything. Still, I hope you don't mind the 5k or so price tag depending on what extra's you decide to have instaled in it and keep in mind that you can just get the single 8800M GTX model to cut the cost a bit if really need be.
Also keep in mind that I'm in Australia and got the thing completely decked out so it did end up costing me just over 5k at the time. I'm not entirely sure on the prices in the US but as far as laptop recommendations go, I give that one a 10 out of 10 rating.

<i>*lurk mode on*</i>

Re: Looking for a laptop
 

hehehe all im saying is, if you get a comp with vista dont fret. things will still work just make sure you have the latest version of games. anyway games these days are being made for vista. There are actually games out now that are Vista Only so there you go.
Plus many Vista users think vista is better, its only people who depend on XP that bash Vista.

Re: Looking for a laptop
 

Like anyone who wants to use a PC to make music.
Vista is woeful just as Windows Millennium was woeful. One of the reasons I switched to, and keep using Macs. None of this "the new operating system doesn't work" bullcrap.

Honestly, would you buy a car that doesn't work?
Would you buy a book you had to download/print missing pages for and bind them in yourself?
Would you buy a song that was missing a kick drum you had to self-install?
Would you buy a house that needed window upgrades every year, but when they upgraded, most of the windows let cold air in?

It's a joke man, the whole idea of releasing half-arsed programs rushed out to fit into an unrealistic timeline just so everyone's OS can be manditorily made obsolete and forced into buying upgrades is pitiful. We the consumers need to make a stand and stop buying stuff that doesn't work!!!!!!!!