I watched Bowling for Columbine this morning.

I think his films are very truthful, they cut through the BS and get to the facts. I've heard many different views on his documentaries. I'm curious to know what all of you think about both him, and his films?

You could check out both the books and movies forum and the current events forums (from about a year ago) for some pretty thorough discussion of his "works" to say he is creative with facts is a gross understatement, almost like saying he's a little overweight.

lots of people think his info is fake, but i feel like it's the truth. i've agreed with most if not all of the things he says in his videos.

<font color="cyan">I like him, I think he speaks the truth.

Plus he made a video about how Bush is a tit, so he's gotta be cool right?</font>

His films are biased, they ignore contradictory facts and he moulds facts to fit his arguement. However i feel his films help to highlight problems and issues and if you take into account the bias, his films do make reasonable cases.

In fact, they would be better without the hyperbole, as there is surely enough evidence to construct convincing cases without this, and in including it he weakens his whole arguement.

I can't tell you, as the TOS prevents such language on this Forum. Lying piece of dung...

He's an ass.

He's a joke. Tells one side of an argument, gives only facts that support his side, never really tells it like it is. Like Rush Limbaugh with a camera.

I suppose he balances out Bush then! [img]smile.gif[/img]

I consider him to be a comedic anti-Limbaugh. He's funny enough so you listen to him, but in the core he's still an arrogant pest.

lol, Limbaugh and facts don't even belong in the same sentence.

It is fun to see American conservatives get their collective underoos in a knot over him. It's also fun to see what kind of juvenile fat jokes 50 year old pundits and politicians come up with lol. You'd think they'd be experts at dealing with political commentary masked as something else* [img]tongue.gif[/img] I enjoy his films (tell me it's not entertaining to see the overbearing, overweight Moore chasing down people yelling for a minute of their time), but I don't believe a word of them unless I read it from a more credible source. Even where I think he's right, his methodology doesn't lend credibility to his work, so he gets a F from me as a social scientist [img]smile.gif[/img]

I agree with Aragorn that his hyperbole is unnecessary for the points he wants to make (haven't seen 911, so no comment there), yet there are well done documentaries on, say, the woes of outsourcing that will never enjoy 1/10 of the recognition of Roger and Me. I guess most people would rather be entertained than learn something.

Morge's suggestion to check out the other threads is a good one. The Bowling and 911 threads handled it pretty evenly from what I read.

*Cheap shot at conservative media, nothing more, nothing less.

Moore uses creative liscence to woo his audience. Aside from a combination of differint film making techniques used in documentaries to apply drama to reality in politics he's risen above the average conspiracy theoriest and has established himself as not just A documentary film maker but THE documentary film maker.

Frankly, I just like indy films... But I did see bowling and farenheit which were both pretty good. He isn't afraid to draw conclusions, I'll say that. The world we live in is filled with a lot of corruption and back-handed stuff, this doesn't mean its as easy to see out in the open, though.

If you look into bush's past (and his cabinet) you'll find just about everything being done in the name of self-improvement in regard to one's wallet.

The problem with our government is that our big businesses are controlled by our government and whent he government shows BIAS toward business there's only the government, itself, to determine what should be done about it. It doesn't matter which party is in office! The Clinton's had white water too.

The reason Bush's governmental corruption is so intriguing is the fact that... Every single thing he seems to do... EVER... is done in the name of his friends.

That doesn't mean he's an evil grand schemer, just that he's so self-centered he doesn't care about the causes he claims to support as much as the support of companies like Haliburton and his middle eastern oil buddies.

<font color="cyan">I understand what you mean about the bias, and that he tells only one side.

But, the argument he puts forward is very good. In some points, I wouldn't care what the other side was. His side is too good.

Especially on the gun cases, I don't know how you can justify the "x" ammendment where you have the right to own guns. Thats just bullshit, and causes far more deaths than it prevents.

So I'm with Moore all the way on that one!!

</font>

Your opinion of Michael Moore?

Google for the word "failure".

The top two results say it all.

lol!!!!

WHat's the 5th result all about??!

He ROCKS :D


Oh - and he's sooooooooo cute [img]smile.gif[/img]

My opinion?

Unmitigated ass. He is ass incarnate.

Where was this lard bucket when clinton bombed Kosovo?
What about the Monica Story, when is he going to do that one (on film, that is)?

Then there must be some truth that he can only do one sided controversy, and only limit it to HIS arguments and points of view.

All in All, just another wind bag.

Over-weight and opinionated, alot like many of his fellow Americans. ;) I also think he has more in common with some of his critics than those critics would ever admit. He's a decent filmaker, but I don't think he's all that great of a writer.

Oh, yeah let's not forget "incredibly easy target" as a descriptor.

[ 06-22-2005, 10:22 PM: Message edited by: Chewbacca ]

First reply and the personal insults are flying in. :rolleyes: so unexpected!

What do I think of Moore? Who cares? I just enjoy standing back watching the right-wingers frothing at the mouth and knotting their knickers before they settle back in a sofa and switch on the Fox 'news'

Some people struggle to comprehend the concept of irony :D

First reply and the personal insults are flying in. :rolleyes: so unexpected!

What do I think of Moore? Who cares? I just enjoy standing back watching the right-wingers frothing at the mouth and knotting their knickers before they settle back in a sofa and switch on the Fox 'news'

Some people struggle to comprehend the concept of irony :D </font>[/QUOTE]And nothing was contributed by this post, not surprising coming from you.

Sums up my thoughts on him quite nicely. The most entertaining thing about Moore is watching people, especially those conservatives that can fairly be considered "people," when they REACT to him. The reactions are funnier than he will ever be.

[ 06-23-2005, 10:11 AM: Message edited by: Timber Loftis ]

Morg, just a reminder, as this looks like it fits the bill- if you have personal issues with any other member posting, please take them to private chat. Thanks!

On topic: Got to say, I think your post was the most descriptive, Lucern! Well worded and clear! [img]smile.gif[/img]

Cloudy, that is almost word for word the kind of attack I have received in the past with no Moderator intervention for several pages of a thread.

http://www.ironworksforum.com/ubb/cg...=001774#000007

http://www.ironworksforum.com/ubb/cg...=001774#000014

for example.

http://www.ironworksforum.com/ubb/cg...=001818#000001

{edit} You are right of course, just because others have treated me poorly is no excuse for my own behavior. I would like to formally apologize for my out of line comment.

[ 06-23-2005, 12:45 PM: Message edited by: Morgeruat ]

Thanks, Morg. That's a very classy last paragraph and I appreciate your thought! [img]smile.gif[/img] For the first part, I will just remind everyone that if you feel you've been flamed or ToS violated at any time, hit the report post link! Mods can't always see everything going on, even if they are in a thread too (if it's long or has lots of longer posts) but we do try to be fair when we have to weigh in on something.

No apology needed Morgeruat, but still nice. We are from opposite ends of the political spectrum. :D

When I saw the thread title I guessed that there would be a 'Fat' comment within the first few posts before I even started to read, the fact that it was you or someone else made no difference, I just don’t see what fat has to do with his art/ medium / views.

My contribution to the debate was in the form of people claiming his views are biased and then seeing no irony in watching Fox news. The point was a generic one and not aimed at anyone specific.

Once again no offence taken [img]tongue.gif[/img]

I think when everyone here is posting, no matter what the topic is, you have to remember that there are tons of members here from all over the world, and all shapes and sizes, beliefs, etc.etc. etc. Using any sentence that seems to mock being "fat" will never go over well here, just as mocking being skinny, or anything else physical.

And people have to understand that with the huge diversity of people here, there will always be conflicts re certain issues and topics. People are going to disagree all the time, it's how you handle it that is important. There comes a time where you have to just agree to disagree.

Sorry but I do not participate in certain topics because I simply don't want to get beaten down by somebody else who may be more pushy re the subject, seen it happen over and over again, and that kinda sucks for me, cause I would like to add comments in certain areas now and then, if it weren't for that factor. And I also tire of hearing people complain about getting harsh words directed towards them that are guilty of the same exact thing. Heck wasn't too long ago I saw a long standing member called an outright Bitch in a thread, with no repercussions. It's just kinda sad for me on my end watching it all sometimes here. :(

[ 06-23-2005, 10:13 PM: Message edited by: ladyzekke ]

You're a sweetheart Wendy. [img]smile.gif[/img]

LOL - and you got Faux News in as well [img]smile.gif[/img] That is triple letter value on the frothing, double word score on the knockers - sorry - knickers, and triple word score on the Faux propoganda reference. I would love to pay a bonus on the ironical irony reference, but I am not sure the rules of subtitle allows it without a pastry convened sub-committee ;)


Edited to remove Morgie's post. It was nested when I quoted Wellard but removed the nesting to show that I was cheeringly amused by Wellard's words in a general sense only.

[ 06-24-2005, 05:20 AM: Message edited by: Davros ]

ROFLALWP - I can't stop laughing - something about that right wing knickers reference is eating at me :D

I'm 5'8" 265lbs (120KG) which is rather... large myself, being a member of similar... girth... I understand parhaps better than many members the challenges of being overweight, and in the same breath that I'm poking fun at Moore's weight, I'm also poking fun at my own.

It's rather interesting to see how people view him, and slam him because he exercises his right to freedom of speech.

I suppose I should end this now, and possible move it to the Current Events forum.

Could a moderator either move this to a more appropriate venue or close it all together?

[ 06-24-2005, 08:51 PM: Message edited by: Zebodog ]

Did you not ask for 'direct' opinion of him?
Are you one of his croonies, and know you feel ashamed?

Basically, if you don't want to really know something, don't ask!

This is no-where near anything that should be in the CE forum.