Should women be banned from men's football?

The world football governing body, Fifa, has ruled that a leading female Mexican footballer should not be allowed to play for a professional men's club. Maribel Dominguez had signed for the Mexican second-division club Celaya which would have been a first for football in North and Central America.

However, the Fifa executive committee has said that the division between men and women in the sport should be maintained. Do you agree with the Fifa ruling? Should women be barred from playing men's football?

Of course there is an argument that it would then allow men to play for the womens teams. How can you ban one and allow the other?

That's a really tough one. If it's good for Football (soccer) then it's good for anything else as well. I've argued for years that women should be equal to men in golf. But, would they fair poorly and drop out all together?

I dunno, the whole quest for equality thing is kinda silly where phsyical things are concerned. Where physical differences between the genders are relevant, they should stop trying to be equal and instead emphasise the different skills of the genders. Men will always be stronger and faster, women will always be more flexible and more elegant, just accept it and move on and concentrate on the sports that those traits allow. So I don't think women and men should play professional football together because of the unfair physical differences (in general, obviously there will be some women stronger and faster than some men etc.).

[ 12-20-2004, 08:05 AM: Message edited by: Vaskez ]

Men are on average physically stronger than women, so I don't think women would fare well in mixed teams. Football can be a rough sport, and I wonder what a man would do if he faced a female opponent. Now, female football players are not wimps, but can they really play alongside men and not be treated different than male players?

I don't think it should be allowed. If you allow women to play men's football, then you can't really stop men playing women's football, and then there will be no women left in the game... or only a very few...

Very similar to the golf debate. Personally I think the gender division protects both men's and women's professional sports. If you eliminate that division you'll end up with a few top women perhaps breaking into mens professional sports, but you'll also get thousands of men who aren't quite good enough for mens teams clogging up the womens teams and reducing the number of women who are able to compete professionally.

lol... or what Callum said (he beat me to the post. [img]smile.gif[/img] )

[ 12-20-2004, 10:50 AM: Message edited by: Thoran ]

No, I think you should be allowed to play "big-time" regardless of your gender.

Hell, if you're good enough, and perhaps even better than other players why the hell not?!

The best should be playing.

<font color="cyan">Being a big football fan, I'd have to say no. Mainly, because women wouldn't be able to hack it. This isn't a sexist comment, but it would ruin the game far too much.

I don't know how you Americans play football, but I know the standard is no where near what the English Premier league is. Now, some women may possibly be just as good as the males in technical football ability, but, a male would not be able to play football properly against a female. He just wouldnt be able to tackle a female, as if he seriously hurt her, which is probable, imagine the media response.

In the English league, things get fairly rough and tempers fly, there is fighting, etc, and a man would just not be able to play properly knowing its a women on the recieving end of a Vinnie Jones diving headbutt. (just kiddin).

But, anyway, no. They may be good enough, but just down to the physical side, it would ruin the game.

Stick to the womens league, as I personally believe this can be quite enjoyable.</font>

[ 12-20-2004, 10:56 AM: Message edited by: Lavindathar ]

I think that they should be allowed to play. Everyone has the right to do it. Let them play. But on the other (and more realistic side) it wouldn't be wise. Men are naturally more stronger and agile, (not necessarily faster). It would be really bad if some guy would tackle a woman from behind and she would get injured. It probably would be a media story. And some men wouldn't be concentrated on the game but on something else.
But as I said: if they have a wish, let them play. In the end, they must be prepared to suffer any conequences or injuries. (If any are inflicted during the match)
Something else has come to mind: what would happen if they are to go showering together after the match? :D

Hmm...good point Lavindathar, I didn't see that side of the argument before.

<font color="cyan">My wisdom comes but once a year. You just witnessed it.

*starts saving wisdom for next years bright comment*</font>

Yes, women should be banned from men's football. They have leagues of their own, let them stick with that. Too bad if one or two are much better than the rest, should make their lifes much more easier on the pitch. Besides, it would become kinda embarrassing for them when players swap shirts after the match wouldn't it ? :D

strangely, I find my self agreeing with you guys on this.....
if a woman plays against a man, one of 2 things will happen, he will be to easy on her out of fear of bad publcity if he did hurt her. or he is too rough on her trying to prove she can not handle being in the sport.
here in America, there has been a couple of women who have played for highschool and college teams, and they were able to handle it, but at great cost.


bad typos, bad.....


(did I get em all that time?)...Leave me alone I have only had one cup of coffee...

[ 12-20-2004, 02:21 PM: Message edited by: Stormymystic ]

nah, the women's league is on the way forward, maybe some day it will be an as prominent sport as men's football, but if the best players start playing with men, where does that leave all the other women who, lika many men, are mediocre by their standards?

and all the stuff you other guys said, too :D

Well sorry but i would never go to the stadium for a match between two women's teams, it's just not right. No matter how good they are, or could become, it's just not the same. I'd go see em in a mudwrestling contest any day, but leave football to the boys please. :D

<font color="cyan">Agreed Johnny, i wouldnt go to watch them at a stadium, but I've seen it on T.V some times, and its ok!!!

Stormy, glad you commented on the typo's, cos otherwise I would have done! [img]smile.gif[/img] </font>

Sigh, there is still typos in it huh? *goes back and reads it again*

Perhaps you could have mens lower leagues, women's lower league, and a mixed premiership anf championship (first division). then you protct grass-roots developmnt, but alow the very best to compete equally.

I say no way. My thoughts have already been posted by Lavindathar and Thoran. I think they should stay in their own league, afterall, it is called men's football ;)

Is that beacuse only men are allowed to play it, or because it is played only by men?

If a woman thinks she's good enough to play with men then by all means let her. She'll quit by her own decision quickly enough if it turns out she isn't skilled or tough enough to play at that level.

I'm really all for women playing with men as long as they play on the same level. Women's football is about as exciting as watching paint dry, so this is the only way I'd get to see some girls on the pitch. ;)

But is this not restraint of trade? If a women was good enough to play (say for Liverpool) and earn $10,000 a week, but then fifa banned her and she had to play in a womens only league where she could only get a $100 a week, is that not unfair and a easy law case to win? I doubt that there is a court in Erope or North America that would not back her.

Strangely enough, while I am against women playing in mens golf tournaments (unless they are willing to use the mens tees like Annika did last year - you go girl), I am quite comfortable with them playing football.

In football they compete on an equal playing field - there are no special forwards tees or compensations for the (generally speaking) weaker sex. While I don't think there are many women that could compete well against the professional football player, and I would be very surprised to see any at anything close to elite level, I don't see why they should be discouraged or barred entry. Let them find the appropriate level at which they can compete and slot them in where they fit based on ability.

Dude, that would mean nothing else then destroying the sport. The public would stay home, i have no doubts about that. This has been brought up before here in the Netherlands, they wondered if women wouldn't be an asset for the game, and i can say "definitely not" to that. Some women's team that just won some kind of big championship played against a first division club here, and after 15 minutes the score was somewhat 5-0 or 6-0, i forgot. Just a reminder that even the best women on the planet aren't good enough to take on the lesser players in the men's world. Same happened with Serena Williams in tennis. On the height of her career, everyone thought that with her power she could probably compete in men's tournaments. Well, they gave her a shot, i believe against a player who had an ATP ranking above 200, and she got thrashed, didn't stand a chance, that's how big the difference is in some sports between men and women. So don't even go there, unless you wanna kill the sport of course.

Ahh..women in men's sport. How interesting. You know this reminds me while I was still schooling at secondary school. The school gathered a team of girls footballer ( for the coming girls football tournament ) and have a little match against us boys. Guess what? 3 minutes into the game the score is already 4 - 0 ( boys are leading of course ). Not long after that the girls start to shout foul because of unwanted hands start to fly in all direction. At one time the girl's team goalkeeper cried because my friend blast the ball right at her. Wanna know what's the final result is? there was none! the goalkeeper was so afraid of returning to her post ( after finish crying ) that the match has to be abandoned! heh! imagine that. :rolleyes:

So you see, I strongly against women to play in a men's sport. Especially in football.

Well for my opinion there has to be a common sense rule that at least at an amateur level, men and women’s sport (not just football) should be separated with few exceptions.

However

When it comes to professional sports women should have every right to compete on an equal basis. By that I mean true equality not this rubbish like in golf where they change the tee distance and such. My opinion does seem to be in the minority but I really do wonder if the law is not on my side.

In 'real' life I doubt a lady would manage to play premier league football, but I'm quite sure that one day soon they could be of a standard to play second division. With of course the chance to play against Man utd in a cup match. I hope it happens in my lifetime

Wellard your argument makes sense and I think definitely could have legal backing... but as stated earlier it's a double edged sword you're wielding and I think that's why people have been hesitant to push the issue.

If women started legally pushing to be able to compete in "men's" sports, they very well might win, but such a prescedent would SURELY spell the end of womens sports. For every woman like Annika who could make the cut on the PGA there are THOUSANDS of men who are not quite that good but more than good enough to destroy the LPGA as a venue for developing female talent. The success of the few would spell the failure of many as men took slot after slot on the women's tour.

As I said, the protection of seperate leagues goes both ways.

[ 12-21-2004, 12:00 PM: Message edited by: Thoran ]

Oh yeah, i can hear the Red Army's chants already, man...will they have a ball that time. :D

You forget that football is a typical macho world. I remember how guys with long hair got treated by the fans. Imagine 50.000 fans who all make girlie sounds whenever the guy in question is in possession of the ball. And god forbid a gay player ever comes out of the closet, his life will be over. There won't be a stadium on this planet where he won't be ridiculed all night long.

I stick with my earlier statement, women have no place in the world called football, not now and not ever. I remember they let a woman act as a linesman here the other day, god knows why but they gave it a shot. Well, i think she cried for a week when the match was over, and not just because of reactions that came out of the crowd, but from the players as well.

Not that I know football (soccer) or who Vinnie Jones is, But the above is true. AND what would happen to the teammates who watched Vinnie just wreck the hot new chick on the team, They would go overboard and break his legs. Its not that they can't necessarily compete (which a select few might be able to) its that when we guys see some guy squash a chick (even in a legal move) we will go crush [img]graemlins/1pissed.gif[/img] [img]graemlins/fighting.gif[/img] that guy. The ref's will be throwing red cards left and right (ok, I do know a little about soccer)

SilentThief

Saying what has already been said:

Speaking as a woman (that's right. . .) I think. . .

Well. If she REALLY wants to, sure. . .But FIFA should not be held responsible for any injuries she may have.

I think that as a philosophy women should be able to do anything men do. But realistically?. . .Come on. Football has alot to do with strength in the upper body. That is just not our thing. We are more leg people, ya know?

Funny enough I'm a leg person myself [img]graemlins/heee.gif[/img]

It seems to me that this decision is opening up a whole can of worms legally, and taking women’s rights back to pre 1970's. Wether woman are 'able' to compete equally is open to discussion but to actively BAN women !!! :eek:

ANd btw Welcome to Ironworks <font color=plum> Xan the Enchanter </font> [img]graemlins/happywave.gif[/img]

I agree Wellard, it is not right to ban women from sports, but also, is it right to allow a woman to play knowing what the outcome will be? yes, I am a woman and all, but could not see myself playing any kind of football, be it American or others. I played it with my brohters growing up, and ended up with so many broken bones and black eyes that my parents made me quit playing.

Regardless of the outcome if you want to play, you need to except the outcome. You can't have your cake and eat it too. [img]smile.gif[/img]

Regardless of the outcome if you want to play, you need to except the outcome. You can't have your cake and eat it too. [img]smile.gif[/img] </font>[/QUOTE]true, but knowing that men would not play fair with a woman (either to rough or to easy on them) I think that this would cause to many conflicts. for that reason alone I think women should not play in the same league as men.

<font color=plum>That's a good point about your friends' reaction, <font color=deeppink>Kakero</font>. As others have pointed out, men's football can get very rough. If a woman wants to play on a men's team, then she should ask herself if she TRULY wants to get the SAME treatment as all the other men - including the Vinnie Jones diving headbutt (whatever that is).

I know in the American version of football, it would simply be impossible for a woman to compete because there is SO MUCH hitting and tackling. The few females that HAVE managed to get on a football team in high school invariably made the team as the field goal kicker. That's about the ONLY position where the other team isn't allowed to crush the player.

This isn't a slam against women in any way. It's just an acknowledgement of the fact that there IS an inherent difference in physical size and strength between men and women and that will always be the case (with a few rare exceptions of course).

From what I've seen on TV of soccer (football to the rest of the world), it does look a bit "safer" than the American sport of football - so perhaps a woman could compete on the men's level a bit easier. But listening to the descriptions of the action from all the other fans of the sport here, it sounds like she would still stand a good chance of getting pounded on a regular basis.

Most experiments of women "crossing over" into men's domains has not worked. The female golfer (that I believe <font color=white>wellard</font> mentioned earlier) managed to get permission to compete in a men's tournament, and was eliminated early in the second round. A few years ago, a female went to the Supreme Court here in America demanding the right to attend a previously all-male military academy. The Supreme Court said the school MUST change their enrollment policy to allow the female cadet. There was a big brouha about it in the media for most of the summer. However, the media did NOT make much of a story when the female DROPPED OUT of the Academy about halfway through her 1st semester. Yeah, I'm sure she got a LOT of razzing from some of the other students, but I'm also sure there were some that "took up" for her. The bottom line was that she couldn't cut it.

Personally, it makes me angry when women cry "discrimination" if they aren't allowed to participate in an all-male venue - but it's perfectly alright for them to keep all-female venues in similar areas. I wonder what the Supreme Court would say if a male student sued to be allowed to attend an all-girl college?

But as for men "crossing over" to the female teams in sports - it ain't gonna happen. Seriously, what man wants to admit that he can't play with the guys so he has to go the GIRL'S team in order to compete? Again, no slam against women at all, just stating a fact. Any "crossing over" in sports will definitely be a ONE WAY street.</font>

[ 12-24-2004, 07:44 AM: Message edited by: Cerek ]

Then obviously you've never seen a match between two South American teams, or southern European. Most footballplayers can make it look like nothing really happened, even the camera misses a lot of foul actions, but put an Argentinian team in the field against a side from Uruguay, and you're set for a bloodbath, broken legs, bloody faces, dislocated shoulders, the complete package.

People who think that football isn't such a hard sport don't know a big deal about it and have obviously never played it themselves, otherwise they wouldn't make such comments. I've played football for 12 years and i've seen it all. I managed to stay clear from severe injuries, but some of my teammates were not so lucky. I'll never forget the sound of a breaking leg when two players collide into eachother.

I agree with Johny, soccer can be a pretty brutal sport, but in comparison with US football, with it's snapped necks and a HUGE number of spinal injuries (in relation to other sports), might seem tame.

In any case, I think that while it's up the deciding body to decide, I believe that men and women's leagues should remain completely seperate, if only for the mental side of the game. Also, has anyone noticed NOBODY arguing for a male/female mixed boxing league or combat sports? It's because they don't want a 200 pound man basically beating the living snot of a woman. There are biological differences people, it's black and white.

[ 12-24-2004, 10:11 AM: Message edited by: Sir Degrader ]

Now that is something i'm not so sure about. Put a male of the same weight in a ring with Lucia Rijker, to name one, and he'll have one hell of a time to stay on his feet. I've seen some damn good female fighters on TV and on some events i visited, and you don't want to get fresh with any of em.

<font color=plum>No offense was meant, <font color=silver>Johnny</font>. That's why I made sure to say that it appeared safer compared to the American sport. Then again, your version of football doesn't include any pads.

Soccer/football is slowly gaining popularity here in America, but it still doesn't get much coverage on national TV - so you're right - I haven't actually seen much soccer/football...especially some of the more brutal match-ups you mentioned.

I would think the closest American comparison would be basketball rather than football. Both teams run up and down the court with no pads and LOTS of physical contact (especially near the goal/basket). I don't think there is ANY way a woman could play on the same court as a pro-men's team.

Like you said, it can get very brutal at times.

I know soccer/football is very physical - we just don't see much of that aspect of the game on TV coverage here.</font>

Mike Tyson (Or hell, Marciano) versus Vonda Ward would likely end up with Ward having serious injury. If there is a strength difference in soccer (where the point of the game is not to inflict injury) that can be dangerous, imagine what the difference would be like in boxing (where the whole point is to injure the other guy)