Completed Bg1,Bg2,ToB...
And i really must say...it sucks...it sucks sssooooooooo bad !
It is pathetic compared to Arcanum, Vampire the Masqerade. It is small and so pathetic in comparison..i got higher hopes on NWN...

I mean..BG IS PLAIN BAD !

And all of you poor people being addicted to it...i pity you all !

Everyones a critic right ;)

grrrrrrrrrr, ur not insulting the BG seris right? *mutters darkly* altho I WAS dissapointed with the ending to the seris. I still say there should have been an option to live out the rest of your life as a mortal, but when u die, you become the lord of murder....

Arcanum sucked. But it wasn't as bad as FF2. (shudders)

<font color="gold">Hmm, not good. How can you not like BG2?! It's the best game ever, for crying out loud!
What exactly did you not like it? The graphics are great, the story is great, and all other miscellaneous stuff is outstanding!
So what's there not to like?!</font>

With a title like this will make you BG forum enemy #1, you know.

Leave Kronostia alone, everybody. If the poor soul doesn't like it, that's fair enough. ;)

Besides, it's easy to say that the game sucks - slagging games off without giving reasons why is pretty easy to do. Constructive criticism (pointing out the flaws and suggesting how they could be better done) is much more challenging, which is why so many people slag off and so few constructively criticize. ;)

Oh look, another swede. Hej hej!

I like BG by the way... (thought I had to say something that related to the topic of this posting...) ;)

None of the BG series suk... Arcanum sucks... my reason being, it is too crappy compared to BG... u pity the addicts?... i pity you greatly my friend... may god smile upon ur soul...

[ 07-13-2002, 10:41 AM: Message edited by: eLLithid ]

Hej hej ! [img]smile.gif[/img]

And hmm...you want exact thingys aside from that i really dont like it..
linear...1 possible ending..HOW LAME ISNT THAT !

Arcanum gives u several choises ! And playing evil ? hello...non existant in BG series...u got to roleplay to be a baddy....
SAD !
Plain simple, BG series suck...and Memnoch, dont tell them to stop, i love a good discussion, and would could possibly be better in a Bg forum ? And i dont have a soul..cause they dont exist..got damn religious fanatic...

BG SUCKS !

[ 07-13-2002, 10:36 AM: Message edited by: Kronostia ]

BG does not suck [img]smile.gif[/img]

But BG 2 has much nicer graphics than Arcanum.

So you'd rather be spoon-fed a bad guy character? BG is a roleplay game, therefore complaining about having to roleplay in it is a bit strange.

Not when you miss out on Xp for playing a baddy ;)

OK, fine, there is that, but still, you can't hate a game purely because you cant be evil and it has one ending (which most games have anyway)

BG2 is still less restrictive than most of the other 'great' RPGs like the Final Fantasy series - you don't even have any choiceof dialogue in them

LLOOOOLLLLLLL dont even START to compare BF to the FF series cause they arent even in the LEAGUE....FF rocks BG at any given time....

Riiiight...

so you dislike BG2 cos it has one ending and you can't play the baddy very easily (without roleplaying - in an RPG)but you love the FF series despite it being worse than BG2 on both these counts?

lol..FF is different from Bg...the story and turns in FF...lol BG doesnt even come close...and the style of fighting and everything is totally different... And the personal lives of the characters in FF is sssssooooooooooooo more alive and complex then BG so....

I still say..BG sucks

Plot twists...
Vampirism, family killings, curses, killing former friends, etc. don't appeal to you as plot twists?

Personal lives...
You can't have played the game without noticing the banter between your NPCs, the romances (which have SERIOUS character development in them - turning your whinging little elf girl into a proud mage or turning a black hearted Drow soft and gooey like butter) and the web of friends, alliances, contacts and enemies that abound in BG2.

Please....the deept of the Characters in FF, Bg chars r nothing in comparison...n Vicky n Aery...BAH....

I'll have to agree with Kronostia. Final Fantasy at least doesn't TRY to give the appearance of choice, plus the combat system and characters are cooler. Also, you DO have SOME choice in the FF games, it's not 100% linear. You generally have at least one point in the game where you can spend some time just exploring the world.

Arcanum would have been FAR better than the BG series if it hadn't been for some unfortunate balance issues between technology and magic.

Vampire? I had far more fun playing that than the BG games. BG1 was sorta fun, but BG2 and ToB were totally munchkin games.

I'll agree that bg2 and ToB are munchkin games, but that doesn't make them less enjoyable, for an example, I always get Carsomyr as my second quest (nalia's keep being the first) I think the BG series is alot less linear than any of the FF games, with the exception of the first one (which did manage a few open area's where you could go at your own pace) and in bg you don't have to walk in a circle for 2 hours to lvl up enough to be able to survive the next bossfight, I can enjoy the FF games sometimes, but it's just too much boring repetition most of the time. BG actually makes you think about strategy, and if you have a mage/sorceror, you have to PLAN how to use your spells, or what spells to get, you have alot more options with bg, and can have alot more fun, once you've played through FF once there's nothing else to see, unless you want to pick up the randomly dropped item, and then you have to spend 6 hours walking in a circle fighting spawned monster in order to have a chance fo finding it.

<font color="gold">There's plenty of time to explore the world in chapter 3 and 6.... :rolleyes: </font>

There are no world in BG ! Just some puny easy a*ss mini quests... in FF u got an ENTIRE WORLD ! And all those very interesting thingys to do in it ;)
No offense...but BG may be good games...but totally not to my liking...and Yes...Arcanum is not very balanced as Magic is overwhelmingly stronger...but that also makes it fun..as playing a Tech is so much more difficult !

And Strategy in BG ? What about the Strategy taken against difficult bosses in FF, not to say Vampire...so shush all u Bg fanatics !

Like i stated in my first post, i got my trust in NWN ;)

[ 07-13-2002, 01:00 PM: Message edited by: Kronostia ]

I'm all in favour of critising a game, finding flaws AND advantages but merely to come here and shoot your mouth off simply to annoy people (and that is blatantly what this person is trying to do) is childish.
Ignore the trolls and they can't hurt you!

That wasent very nice...shame on you for being so disrespectful ;)

Ok ive heard what everyone else has said, and ive played the final fantasy series as well as BG and i agree that theres not enough areas, or theres too many mages and not enough normal monsters, and not enough evil plots but baldurs gate still kicks ass, final fantasy had these crappy little plant creatures which looked like you could squash them with your foot, and baldurs gate has dragons with amazing graphics ten times the size of your characters, barely able to fit on the screen. also the whole world thing was stupid, you could walk arround it in half an hour and find only a village or stream every now and again, and it was far to easy, the only hard battles being the weapons and sephiroth. as opposed to arcanium, ihavent even heard of it, and when i looked it up on yahoo i got 12 results and half werent even related to the game, sounds like a great game to me, sorry to get pissed off but you shouldnt come on a baldurs gate forum slagging of baldurs gate.

p.s pobably cause there isnt an arcanium forum.

<font color="gold">Well, remember that BG2 only takes place in a small part of Faerun, and that Faerun is huge. Other epic RPGs, like NWN and Icewind Dale also takes part in Faerun, so that gives a clue on how big it is. If whole of Faerun should be fitted in to BG2, no computer would have room for it. [img]smile.gif[/img] </font>

How dare you have the audacity to say that such a tremendous game sucks. You suck!!! Your pathetic life sucks!!

Baldur's Gate 2 and Baldur's Gate are COOL. They do not suck. There are many quests, plot turns, places to explore, sub-quests, cool items, races, professions and kits, etc. Just because there is no 'world' doesn't mean it is bad. I think they were just making up for BG1 in the BG2 map, in BG1 there were probably 50 places to go, and the Baldur's gate 2 dudes wanted it not to be so confusing, so combined many different places into about 15.

Edit: there are 3196 different characters in BG2. To make a horribly confusing plot for each one of them to add "Personal Life" would take years and a LOT of money, so that would not really be an option, eh?

[ 07-13-2002, 04:06 PM: Message edited by: Willard ]

I have played every single one of the ff series and I just want to laugh at you. poor, misguided soul. *sigh* i feel for you, man. Ff is not anything like Baldur's Gate in that baldur's Gate is actually any good. ff is just repetative crap.
And yes, before you diss me, i am an avid RPG game player, even playing hybrid crossbreeds like Legend of Zelda and the kakky little RPG on the GBA (Golden Sun). baldur's gate is the best. Out of the lot. And you get three different endings in ToB...what more do you want???

Plot twists...
Vampirism, family killings, curses, killing former friends, etc. don't appeal to you as plot twists?

Personal lives...
You can't have played the game without noticing the banter between your NPCs, the romances (which have SERIOUS character development in them - turning your whinging little elf girl into a proud mage or turning a black hearted Drow soft and gooey like butter) and the web of friends, alliances, contacts and enemies that abound in BG2.</font>[/QUOTE]the stories in ff are all crappy likkle ones made up by a stoned science fiction freak anyway. Did you know the Baldur's Gate world has been around since AT LEAST 1985? No, I bet you didn't...did you?
The world has had ample time to develop (which it has done, rather smoothly) with published books such as RA Salvatore's drizzt series providing a solid base. The ff series relies on thousands of crappy...repetative...boringly bland sequals and a host of teenage boys who would have a heart attck over how good Diablo II was.

SPOLIER

BAh it is ONE thing to voice an opion, and totally anotehr to critise someone, because they like a game, or dislike it. You shouldnt be so nasty about the BG seris. Arcanum *was* good, but... it was also annoying; Bg in my opion was a LOT better, and IF u had played TOB u would NOT be complaing at the lack of choices. there were 3. happy? FF seris... dont like it. the only one I *did* like was ff8. and I dont care what u have to say on the matter. squall was a jerk tho, most of the time. anyway thats besides the point. DONT have a go at BG. it WAS original when it came out. I cant think of ANY other game where you were the child of a God. yeah its been done in books, but NOT games. none I can remember anyway.

[ 07-14-2002, 10:18 AM: Message edited by: Calaethis Dragonsbane ]

Yep it's definatly a key Sci fi/fantasy theme.

BG and BG2 not good? Well I guess that's your opinion, but I seriously do think you've underestimated the game a little.

Sure, in Baldur's Gate and Baldur's Gate 2, you do have a lot of mini-quests. However, mini-quests are fun and refreshing from the big quests. Also, at least in Baldur's Gate 2, you can pick to roleplay an evil person. An evil person doesn't just go around killing people, they do evil things.

You can choose to side with Bodhi.

A theif steals, which is considered an evil act.

After all of the 'mini-quests', it's your option to go and kill every single little villager all you want. The fact that you lose reputation for killing 'good people and innocent people' portrays a realistic view. Do you see any killers and murderers and theives winning any popularity contests in the real world? No.

Both games have good graphics, and a decent plot with many little plots added to it with the mini-quests.

The characters aren't developed enough? Just because they don't show absolutely every single little aspect of a character's personality doesn't mean that the characters aren't developed enough. Do we really want to know every single little aspect of a fictional character? I know I don't want to know what Anomen does when he gets constipated, and I sure don't want to know about Aerie's feminine problems! We get enough of a view of the character's to have satisfaction.

Jaheira in BG2 is a woman who just lost her husband and is conflicted at whether she should move on or remain single. She also has to deal with a conflict of a personal matter. The person she possibly falls in love with either threatens the balance, or restores it. Meanwhile, her friends and co-workers think that she's betrayed them, or that she's blinded by her friend who happens to be a little different. She has to fight her co-workers and friends without almost any choice because they attack. She has two outcomes, either she sees you as being an ultimately good person who will restore the balance and she will get her occupation back, or she won't and she'll be confused as to what choices she should have made and never get her job back.

Aerie is a woman that has lost something very dear to her, her ability to fly. She has also lost some of her limbs in a sense and feels like a 'cripple'. She's utterly in dispair, because she can't do something she used to do. She's just like all of those people who have lost their legs and now have to depend on someone else to do something because they can't do it for themselves anymore. She feels weak, helpless, dependent just because she lost her ability to fly. She needs someone to help her see that she has a whole world ahead of her to look forward to.

All of the characters have a major personality trait that surfaces through. All personality traits that are that big aren't just one thing, they're many things. I can't be just a happy person for not having any reasons or other personality traits that help with that happiness. Neither can a fictional character.

As for BG2 having one ending, where? At the end:

S

P

O

I

L

E

R

If you romanced anyone, you have four romanced endings for an NPC that include your own future, leaving a lot of imagination to what happens.

You can also choose to be a god, or remain a mortal.

That's a total of 6 possible endings, two possible endings for your character, or one possible ending whether they romanced or not. If they romanced, they can still pick godhood.

These are all very good arguements..But one thingy..i played BG series for 6 months...been active here checking for quests i havent done....i did SoA, ToB TDD, Bg1, that add on and some of the mods to it... have DONE The BG series...
So i got some flesh on my bones when i diss this game..'
To Compare game endings in BG and Arcanum...geeeeezz u ppl got no idea what ya talkin about...
S
P
O
I
L
E
R
In ToB you HAVE to fight melissan and kill her..then u choose what u wanna be.. in Arcanum u get a few choises...
Side with the ultimate evil and end all life on earth...fight him and save...or fight him and then kill all life anyways(my fav)...

And BG is a very shallow game...no feelings or emotions like in the FF series... Cloud..the most complex character created for a RPG game...
And stop with the lame personal attacks will ya, my i pity you was meant as fun ;)
And i still think that Bg series is low compared to the other RPG/Fantasy games out there ;)

Calaethis! Would you mind putting a spoiler mark in your first post! [img]graemlins/1pissed.gif[/img] Thanks a lot...

In my experience, Bg has been fun. *shrugs* It's all a matter of opinion, Rather pointless to go back and forth saying "Bg sucks!" "No it doesn't!" "Yes, it does" "No" ""yes" Don't you think? ;) Kronostia's entitled to his/her opinion. I doubt anyone can change it. ;)

Hey, Krono, I agree that Cloud was an amazing character. Except for being such an awful wuss, Vincent should've been the main character instead ;)

If in Arcanum all you get is one more choice as compared to BG2: TOB, then what difference does it make? Also, like I already pointed out, just choosing isn't the ending, you still have the romances that tell the 'true' ending if you did have a romance.

Baldur's Gate itself may not have any 'depth', however what would you expect from a game made in 1996 for a PC? I can't remember that many games during that year made purely for 'depth', maybe only 3.

Baldur's Gate II has depth. It leaves a lot to the imagination.

Besides, this is all a matter of opinion. You may only think that BG is bad because you only spent 6 months on it. Truthfully, that's a long time to spend on a game, IMO.

I spent one and a half years on Baldur's Gate 2, I got it before I got Baldur's Gate. Most of the time, I restarted the game (Around Chapter 2) because I wanted more experience in the game (Another positive, you can re-import your character). I spent a lot of time on this game and had fun each time I played it.

I only spent a month on Baldur's Gate.

More time can make a difference, especially if you notice things that people tend not to notice.

Awesoem Arguement!!

BG Pros:

Ok, BG offers the cahnce to go totally evil, or totally good, and offers great classes and modficatsions to classes already inputted (dueling a thief for a mage)

Offers wide variety of wqeaposn choices. Youc an be good in bowmans hip and the blade

The massive plot development is amazing. You start of stupid in soem dungeon, to relizeing yuor soul has been stolen and must retrieive before it is used to becoema and god, and your left dead.

Cons: Your story is very comprized around a certain one thing, so beign a really good mage, or supremee ranger of good, does you no good, cause thats what you choose, and the game can't circle aroudn that

FF Pros:

Huge storyline

Awesoem Abilitys

Cool funney moments

You can explore and enitre worlds,w hcih is cool, but is also a con,casue then you know everything

Characters are built, so, for isntance, Cloud from FF7 is a warrior cause he was in Shinra's SOLDIER

Cons:

You can explore the whoel world and all surprize is ruined

No chocie of leadign your main character

Your enitre party developed by game standards,and you are given zero chance

Stupid Characters