At the risk of sounding callous, I'd say that THIS is a top contender for this year's Darwin awards.
What a pathetic idiot...

This reminds me of the trend of kids dieing by hanging while masterbating.
Rediculous.

This makes me think that if you're dumb and weak minded enough to do that, you deserve to die... although if you're dumb enough to say "pass out in front of the camera so we can see you" then I want to know who this person is and where they live so I can go and CHOKE HIM! Grrrrrrrr.
And here I was beginning to think that people in the world were getting smarter, thank god there will always be Americans. :D [img]tongue.gif[/img]

this kind of things is not suprising, just the other day before CNY, there was this woman sitting on the ledge of a building apparently wanting to jump down. everybody on the ground shouted for her to jump down, some even went betting to see if she jump or not. * sigh *

It's pathetic... I'm sorry, but I think that he deserves to die... although i'm sorry for the parent's tho... Dumb asshole...

Why?, one's suicide, the other's for sexual gratification, you're not supposed to die.

Yes, their not supposed to die. They orgasm right at the point of exfisiation (sp?). Suposed to be a rush. A kid in Eureka,CA did it and didnt quite make it to the point where, I guess, your supposed to lift yourself up or some such crap. I was friends with some guys who knew the kid in highschool. They showed me the newspaper report on his death. Pretty cazy.

My, aren't we all quick to condemn the kid? Sheesh. Do you have any idea what kind of mental anguish and agony leads a person to contemplate suicide? Teenagers are usually more vulnerable to those feelings than others, thankfully they're not normally strong enough to lead to actual death, but sometimes they are. Does any of you actually KNOW anything about what that kid felt? Yeah so he was an attention seeker, does that mean he deserves to die? The article said he was prescribed anti-depressants earlier. He might have suffered serious depression. Now, a lot of teens sometimes get those feelings, and usually their "suicide attempts" are just cries for help/attention. Don't you think it's at all possible that when this kid went online, he was looking for just that? Help, attention, some sympathy. In that state of mind, already feeling useless, unloved and better off dead, what the hell do you think happens if people encourage you to kill yourself, laugh at you, ridicule you, don't take you seriously? Of course, you think "See? I KNEW all along. I'm better off dead". And there he goes...
He was stupid, an attention seeker, probably not too clever, and a bit of a drama queen. But he was probably also a troubled, depressed teen with no clue what to do about it. He did not deserve to die like that. It's the people who egged him on that are despicable and stupid. And it's the few who tried to help him that we should be thankful for. A suicide threat should ALWAYS be taken seriously. Which do you prefer? Treating someone who threatens suicide like a pathetic attention seeker with the risk of that person killing him/herself? Or taking the threat seriously with the risk of having put your time and effort into a drama queen? I know which one I will always choose. Granted, on rare occasions we can make an educated guess at how sincere the threat is, but this case shows that not taking it seriously can actually MAKE it serious, can be the final straw.

Sorry for being vehement about this, but I don't think you have a right to judge people quite so quickly.

[ 02-04-2003, 08:36 AM: Message edited by: Melusine ]

Well I was about to say something very nasty to you all, but Melusine did it nicely.

You should be ashamed to say that someone deserved to die without knowing anything about his life, about the reasons that made him take drugs and so...

This guy and all the ones that watched are somehow deconnected from reality, they need help, not insults.

I see only one good point in this very sad and awful story : maybe it made some of them change their mind about drugs.

I am saddened by what happened to this young man, however it is his own fault. If I am reading this article correctly he was trying to show off.

In response to Melusine, I have only this say. He was not a teenager he was 21. Aswell, I think it is entirely possible he was not depressed per say, just someone who liked to get high.

Yep. And so, based on speculation and our nice ingrained prejudices, we can pat ourselves on the shoulder satisfiedly and say "HE DESERVED TO DIE". Sorry, I don't work that way. I wasn't trying to excuse his behaviour, I was trying to show people you cannot judge a person you don't even know that quickly, let alone make a judgement about their right to live.

Edit: Listen, I'm not saying that my version is any more plausible - merely that it's JUST AS plausible. Why do we immediately choose to think the worst of people?
Oh and a note: the physical effects of puberty are usually comlpeted around the age of 20, but the psychological state of mind can and DOES continue after that. Boys often enter puberty later than girls, and girls mature at an earlier age (generally speaking!) and I've known enough guys around that age who were clearly still struggling with some of the psychological troubles that teenagers do.

[ 02-04-2003, 10:01 AM: Message edited by: Melusine ]

<font color=skyblue>I blame it mostly on the viewers. If that guy would not have had anybody watching and cheering him on...he would not have had such an interest in it. Especially the one that talked the other out of hanging up on the 911 call. Everyone could clearly see that the guy wnet too far, and it was their humane responsibility to allow that emergency call to go through...

I would not be surprised if this were treated like a murder case.

If I was the parents, I'd definately be pursuing some sort of legal action against those kids. </font>

i blame it on him for thinking he was macho for handling the drugs the way he did and the idiots for watching him and rooting him on..

auto erotic asphixiation. Got to be a perverted moron to try it. As far as this guy is concerned, This is really sad. I can't at all blame the people watching because he was going to do what he wanted to do anyways. It said some tried to help, but how were they to know whether he really was taking prescribtion medication? He could have been taking asprin in prescription bottles for all the veiwers knew. none of them even knew his real name, how would they know? Its tyhe kid's own fault he was sad and dpressed and he killed himself, and thats relly all there is to it. It's always sad, but it happens everyday. What makes this one different is that he was logged online at the time, which really doesnt make it much different.

Have to disagree Azrael. With help the kid would probly still be alive. Good friends, even online ones, might have been enough. But he met those freaks instead.

And encouraging someone who says hes taking lethal quantities of drugs is stupid, even if its not clear if its for real or not.

You people are missing something here. The person was taking perscribed drugs for depression and mental illness which may not have been a result of something he did. Mentally depressed people do not function normally unless thay are taking prescribed doses of medication. At some point if he mixed with other drugs, avoided, or took one two many a relapse could easily occur. Once your brain stops funtioning properly again it is hard to get back on track by yourself because the prescription may no longer even be the correct dosage. A mental relapse could have been the cause of him OD ing as he was not thinking clearly when he did this. Than again maybe not but it is a likely possibility to think about before we cast our stones at him being an idiot, and his fault.

many teenagers make attempts (and some succeed) for attention. i see that this guy obviously wanted attention. that is not something that can be denied. and at 21, whether he was physically or psychologically mature, one can still be depressed. there are numerous adults on anti-depreaants. what is the difference between them and this kid? not much. a little more maturity, and maybe a lot more responsibility, but not all adults are more mature or responsible than him. it is a sad tragedy that this happened. it is a sad dayf or the human race that some of our members encouraged it. but no person here or anywhere else is immune to depression, peer pressure, and drugs. if we take/do drugs we are effected, prescription, over the counter, illegal, we all are effected by them. depression brings us down, makes the liekly hood of wanting/needing drugs higher. and peer pressure...well i once told my husband i never listened to peer pressure, but i know that i have, and i'm sorry morgie that i refused to see that, and admit it during our arguement. i may not have done illegal drugs or sex as a teen because of peer pressure, but i have tried numerous weight loss fads, drugs, diets etc. because i was made fun of and felt outcast because of being overweight. so here and now, i say-NONE OF US ARE VERY BRIGHT, AND WE CAN ALL MAKE THESE SAME MISTAKES. SO DO NOT JUDGE HARSHLY, FOR ONE DAY YOU WILL BE JUDGED!

I agree with most of you post, Mel, especially that many 21 year olds are not very mature. Also that cocktail of drugs would be very depression-inducing. The point that <font color=pink>Galadria</font> picked up on (she read this with me) is the bit about the Internet chat sites that druggies use to trade faking symptoms to get doctors to prescibe prescription medications for them when in reality, they are going to use them recreationally. It is a fact that druggies' stories tend to sound the same, and when we hear some of them, "red flags" go up, that alert the physician and his staff to what we term "drug-seeking behavior." The use of the sentence, "I have just moved to town and am looking to establish myself with a new physician," just about gaurantees that no drugs or prescriptopns for controlled substances will be forthcoming from me. There are many others, such as seductive or overly-friendly behavior. Don't get me started. I cewrtainly agree that the onlookers were guilty of quite reprehensible behavior.

How many times have we had that one drink too many, or misjudged a corner while speeding, or gone to jump over something and fallen on our faces?

Did we deserve to die then?

Well said Mel, sounds like this kid did have problems, and that he made an error.

The amount of times I've narrowly avoided serious injury or death as a result of not thinking, doing something stupid or careless etc, makes me shudder...

Well said Melusine. I was saddened not only by this story, but also by the reactions I was reading. Of course I have been judgemental in the past and I am most certainly no saint, but come on people. A human being is dead. People watched and cajoled him to continue. It is terrible, ugly and all too common. Maybe this is why I don't watch TV news or read papers any longer. They rarely print anything good or uplifting. It's all too depressing.

Mel (and Masklinn, Leonis, Wulfere, Attalus and everyone else) I see where you're coming from, and it's a beautiful place [img]smile.gif[/img] You guys are showing alot of compassion and consideration here, for which I'm sure we're all thankful. But thinking this guy was an idiot and thinking he deserved to die and two entirely different things. For one, it does not seem that he was trying to commit suicide, it seems that he was trying to show off to his so-called internet buddies about how many drugs he could take and how 'hard-core' that made him. I just can't feel warmth toward such people. He was 21, I'm a year younger than he was and I already know how pathetic and childish those sorts of macho show-off games are. If he was sad and depressed and contemplating suicide (and of course, how would I know that he was not contemplating these things. Well, call it a hunch) then I would be right there with you in the 'compassionate consideration' line of thought on this one. A young lad lost his life, it's a horrible thing, but I can't feel the same amount of sympathy for this case as I would for someone who was generally distraught and took their own life in private. He didn't deserve to die, but I (personally) don't think he deserves any more than the standard amount of respect/sympathy for the dead either.
But thank you for putting all of us macho show-offs in our place about the callousness of our posts [img]smile.gif[/img]

[ 02-04-2003, 07:35 PM: Message edited by: The Hierophant ]

Drug addiction is as very much an illness as any other and needs to be treated as such. To say that he deserved to die is akin to saying that cancer patients deserve to die, it's unfounded and quite frankly ignorant.

I think your all reading way to much in this. We dont know his motives. We can assume a lot of things to emphasize our own opinion, but we dont know the true, or whole, story.
What we do know, is he died, from an irresponsable act. We do know that he was "bragging" about his high tolerance, and typed the last words, "I told you I was hardcore". This is pure egotism, and that is what killed him. As far as the chat room goes, its irrelevent. They were his audience. He could have one found elsewhere.

MY opinion is that he killed himself by accident with his OWN stupidity.

Can a guy who'se taken 20 hours of Psychology courses hand one of those out? I'd do it [img]tongue.gif[/img]

all of you views are valid and true... it truth i think there is so many opinions and ideas what had happened but in the end, a person has died and dead is dead. one thing is for sure.. i hoped those cyber so-called-friends would learn the lesson and let thier conscience (if they have one) haunt them for the rest of thier life.

If anyones interested, heres a copy of the chat room log.
http://pages.sbcglobal.net/oea/logs.html

The logs are gone now, if you didn't see them, sorry.

[ 02-06-2003, 12:08 AM: Message edited by: Seraph ]

Phanty, ;)

I wasn't really referring to your "pathetic idiot" but to the people who felt this kid deserved to die. Don't think I don't see where you're coming from. I have lost my uncle to suicide, and I still don't fully get it, though I have some understanding for why he did it. That this kid was so completely careless with his life incenses me. But I know that I can't judge about someone I don't know, and cannot truly know the mindstate he was in. So I would never even THINK he deserved to die. And though I know others disagree with me, I find the notion that someone's stupidity makes them deserve death utterly inhuman and despicable. Like Leonis said, we are all stupid sometimes, but none of us deserve to die, and moreover, NONE of us has the right to say someone else deserved to die. Just MHO.
But yes, I am outraged also at how easily this life was lost, and wish the kid would have been smarter.

Well Mel, I concur [img]smile.gif[/img]

And Seraph, thanks for the link. Quite informative as to what happened that night. By the looks of things there were alot more people telling him not to do it and showing concern than there were those doing the opposite. Some people just don't want to take responsibility for the world around them, sad but true. But fortunately, most people do.

Man, that chat room log really disturbed me :(

I hope this smoke2k guy realises what he has done. He was pushing him to take more and calling him a ■■■■■ when he had already had a lethal overdose. I've also heard that there will be no further police investigations! This is assisted suicide!! Not sure what the laws are in the states on this but some of these guys must be partially responsible for this.

One hour after this child pumps himself full of drugs they start thinking about calling for help. And then they tell him not to call cause the child can get arrested? I can´t believe it!

Even if he did contemplate suicide I find this horrible, stupid and senseless. But according to the log he did call a "friend" and said "he will report this".

Well, <font color=deeppink>Willow,</font> he was of age. But, you are correct, he was acting childishly. Interestingly, they seemed to think it would be worse to serve a short jail term than to possibly die. It's no great stretch to imagine they were, er, impaired a bit themselves.

Yes he was of age, but pulling this stunt on a webcam in front of who knows how old people isn´t mature in my book. I hope the parents don´t see that chat log. :(

<font color=skyblue>A friend of mine sent me the following e-mail.

Definite darwin award contender. We're better off without him. I honestly think a moron who takes enough drugs to numb a Hiyena, and then, deciding that wasn't enough, decided to go even further, and kill himself, deserved what he got. I have more sympathy for people who actually had a bad life.

Did you read any of this thread at all?
This guy had an addiction problem, plain and simple, and needed help. Unfortunately either his family and friends didn't know he had a problem, or just didn't care. After the first dose, he probably lost all common sense and rational thinking when the drugs took control and had no idea what he was doing. To say he deserved what he got, is a childish point of view, showing no understanding about the problems of addiction.
I was addicted to perscription medication quite some time back now, not to this extent mind you, but I know what it's like to be addicted. I was lucky enough to have some people who loved me, pull me out of it.
Perhaps the one good thing in all of this is those that sat and watched may re-evaluate their lives and choose to say "NO."
Oblivion437, this is why he died. Not because he took a lethal overdose, but because he didn't have enough people that cared about him to recognize the addiction and get him the help he required. I've said it once, and I'll say it again:

Addiction, of any kind, is an illness and needs to be treated as such. To say that he "deserved what he got" because he had an illness ensures that this type of thing will continue to happen.

Absolutely horrible.

Actually it's deeper than addiction. He died because he no longer wanted to live. He may not have wanted to die, but he no longer wanted to live. He was escaping. He spent his life trying to escape it. He finaly did.

It is unfortunate that his life ended before he found new will for it, but I don't mourn his death. He got what he wanted. I do feel sorry for his parents, for they have to deal with the issues that he left behind. People who want to live assume that everyone must feel that way and that "life" is sacred. Some don't want to live, and others take that further by wanting to die. There is only one guarantee to life and that is death. It's just the living don't deal to well with that.

I wanted to say more, but I'm not sure what .... maybe I'll think of it later ....

Reading that transcript was horrible. Ack in some ways I wish I hadn't read that. I read the story about what happened, but it is different when you read the actual transcript. :(

I think I read the thing and saw it in a different perspective than others, and my perspective could be wrong, any of ours can, as we never knew Ripper-Brandon. I saw a guy who didn't care about himself or his life, a guy who was depressed and suffering and lonely. I think his "showing off" when he first took those pills was in his own way a cry for attention and help. I think he knew if he posted "I am going to kill myself" he would get a bunch of "■■■■■! Poosy!" etc. etc. type responses. So instead he played it "cool" and calm but still showed what he was doing, even used a webcam so everyone could see him sucking down those pills. He had to know at his age (21) that he was taking a deadly dose. I think if someone had really cared and tried to call him and talk to him, it might have made a difference, but of course that is a big "might." Unfortunately the only guy he got to talk to on the phone was Smoke2K, who knows what that idiot said to him. It DID seem that in the end he actually stopped joking around and was really concerned, I don't blame him, I think he had no idea how serious things were, who knows how old Smoke2K is as well. I really hope that Smoke2K was affected in a big way by what happened to Ripper, and he will think twice next time *he* tries to get high on pills, at least then something good came out of the whole thing.

One thing I also want to say, is people who do drugs are not necessarily bad people, and certainly do not "deserve to die." Most people who get into drugs are trying to just feel happy in a world that they are unhappy in, they just don't realize the consequences and dangers that drugs in the end will give them. Just because some of you haven't done any drugs before doesn't make you a better person than those that have (and I'm not saying anyone said that btw). I've known some incredible people who had weaknesses, whether it be gamblng, drugs, or booze, heck even the Internet has its own addictive qualities. None of us are perfect. We shouldn't condemn and hate people addicted to drugs, we should care, and try to help them get out of it.

Don't darwin awards have to be creative?