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It has been said in the past (by no one here I believe) that the USA is the sole Superpower in the World today!
Superpower: n. a nation which, by reason of its economic, political and military strength, influences the policies of less powerful nations. (The New Lexicon Webster's Dictionary Of The English Language) I guess the question is whether it is a good or bad thing? Is America a Superpower because: 1)We say it is so. 2)Other nations say it is so. 3)We fought a boxing match with the Soviet Union and were the last ones standing. 4)We have the most influence. 5)We are the most benevolent. 6)We are the most arrogant. 7)We have the most wealth. 8)We have the most bombs (of many varieties). 9)It is a catchy name and no other Nation claims it at the moment. 10)We earned it. 11)We deserve it. 12)The world owes us this title. 13)We think no other nation comes close to us. I like to think it is because we truly do try to make the World a better place for everone, even if we are mostly misunderstood. I also believe we are not perfect and mess things up at times. I think the title should be removed from the American Psyche. When there were 2 Superpowers it seemed to be a way to show there were 2 nations holding each other in check and balancing things. Now the word feels selfserving and arrogant. The word needs to go. We are supposed to be a World Leader, in some issues it seems we are a World Deserter. Any Thoughts? ------------------ Still The Most Humbly Prideful (?) Member Of The Illuminati! Mark |
You have a point but it should be said that all Empires end - even Economic ones (which is essentially what the US is in general these days). Sorry if I can't really elaborate on this point but I actually have to go now. Just wanted to stick my oar in I suppose.
------------------ Life is like a piece of cheese. Mice only enjoy it in cartoons and it is better with toast |
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I don't believe America is benevolent in the true sense of the word, but by no stretch are we malevolent. As with most things in life, there is middle ground. While we lean more toward benevolence on a world wide scale, we think of ourselves first. We do those things which are in our own best interest, and historically, have done it in a benevolant manner. We do good things in the world, but for the most part, we do those things with our own interests in mind. This is not a bad thing. Doing things that are good for us and helping others along the way isn't such a bad deal for anyone involved. As to "Superpower", I think it's still appropriate, but I don't believe we are the only one. The problem is that it was used exclusive regarding the US and the Soviet Union. The US and Soviets were the most prominent, but many nations use their economic, political, and military power to influence the policies of lesser nations. I believe Russia is a still a superpower. The Soviet Union's dissolution left many nations, and each of those "new" nations retained differing degrees of that superpower. ------------------ http://www.wizardrealm.com/images/rb.gif http://www.usflag.org/animate/flagwave1.gif "Your right to swing your fist ends where my nose begins." |
I'll make it short and sweet (gotta study http://www.ironworksforum.com/ubb/no...iles/smile.gif):
IMO, the USA are a super power for the following reasons: 1,2,3,4,7,8,10 and 13 ------------------ I'm the Wanderer without a clan... I bring justice without favorism. Though you may not agree with it, my judgement is final... and inconsequential :) |
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LOL! Sorry Ryanamur! Didn't mean to coax you out of you studying with this provocative thread! Now get back to your task at hand! http://www.ironworksforum.com/ubb/no...es/biggrin.gif ------------------ Still The Most Humbly Prideful (?) Member Of The Illuminati! Mark |
Uh, Skywalker, would you talk to me as an equal if I was 1 foot tall and you were 20 feet tall ? http://www.ironworksforum.com/ubb/no...iles/smile.gif
Does anyone take a halfling more seriously than a Stone Giant in any roleplaying game ? http://www.ironworksforum.com/ubb/no...iles/smile.gif Do you remember how Luke had trouble recognizing Yoda because he was so very small ? http://www.ironworksforum.com/ubb/no...miles/wink.gif I hope, I really do, that one day we'll build and Europe which will be able to talk to the US as an equal, not looking like a dozen of Gnomes standing on each other's shoulders ! http://www.ironworksforum.com/ubb/no...es/biggrin.gif ------------------ http://www.ot-nancy.fr/photos_ot/m_office_exterieur.jpg http://www.ironworksforum.com/ubb/no...iles/hero2.gif The world is my oyster ! |
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I really do feel embarrassed when I hear the USA calling itself the only Superpower! I worry that somepeople would want be treated as my equal, because I usually struggle with an inferiority complex and I don't want to bring others down to my level! http://www.ironworksforum.com/ubb/no...miles/wink.gif When I post stuff like this it is less about how I feel and more about wanting to know how others feel. Moiraine! I feel humbled and I am sorry if I offended you in any way. ------------------ Still The Most Humbly Prideful (?) Member Of The Illuminati! Mark |
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I can tell you, it is very difficult to assert authority on people when you are 1 feet smaller than they ! http://www.ironworksforum.com/ubb/no...miles/wink.gif About the US, I'm not saying that it's good or bad, just that it is a fact : you are so much bigger than we other nations are ! http://www.ironworksforum.com/ubb/no...iles/smile.gif ------------------ http://www.ot-nancy.fr/photos_ot/m_office_exterieur.jpg http://www.ironworksforum.com/ubb/no...iles/hero2.gif The world is my oyster ! [This message has been edited by Moiraine (edited 10-29-2001).] |
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You know, since "All men (and women) are created equal", it seems only right that the same should hold true, that all countries are equal. I guess it's a foolish expectation, but I think this World would turn a lot more smoothly if it were so!
I did see your smilies, I just wanted you to know that I really am not comfortable with the "Superpower" designation. ------------------ Still The Most Humbly Prideful (?) Member Of The Illuminati! Mark |
it would be nice if people and nations were equal. however, they're not.
i'm with the gnomes (obviously!) but am happy to be in a situation that can challenge perception and perhaps work towards raising the awareness of others' - myself included, in how the world functions and how we should constantly challrnge inequality on a moral level. not to say i take the moral highground - quite the reverse. i tend to have a bash at understanding the other viewpoint - sometimes i do sometimes not. america does have far too much power in the world today and lots of nations son't like it. i agree that balance is called for. but where that balance could come from is a different question........ ------------------ http://www.angelfire.com/mi4/hclark50/tracey5_10096.gif offended mistress of the illuminati |
America is the most powerful nation in the world today, that much is probably true. If it were benevolent this could be a good thing. But power there is concentrated in the hands of the rich. These people & corperations want to stay rich and get richer and care little for the consequences to others or the enviroment,nor can they care about the long term effects like global warming. The only balencing power there is against america is nuclear weapons.
------------------ http://www.40k.org/grimstalker/imper...d%20emblem.gif There is a tower in the Emperor's palace called the Tower of Heroes, at the summit of that tower hangs the Bell of Lost Souls. Its wailing moan of grief lasts long and reaches the ears of millions, and its tones penetrate the unifying ether of humanity turning the thought of countless billions towards mankind's loss. [This message has been edited by Dramnek_Ulk (edited 10-29-2001).] |
I couldn't agree more - countries are essentially artificial constructs anyway. This is being shown to be more and more true in todays globalised world. Ultimately boundaries of race are simply used to divide people into smaller and smaller groups to allow them to be squashed that bit more easily. With regards to the US they are a Superpower in that the US political system is the voice of the most powerful economic groups on the planet. But the real Superpower is that conglomerate of capital that props it up globally. Even that Empire will end one day though - if you look at Adam Smith all the way through to Karl Marx they will all say "nothing lasts forever".
By the way I actually agree with Ronn on this topic. The US is not openly malevolent but it does put its interest above others. I think me and Ronn will probably disagree on whether that is a good thing or not.... ------------------ Life is like a piece of cheese. Mice only enjoy it in cartoons and it is better with toast |
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http://www.ironworksforum.com/ubb/no...miles/hihi.gif http://www.ironworksforum.com/ubb/no...es/biggrin.gif http://www.ironworksforum.com/ubb/no...miles/hihi.gif ------------------ http://www.wizardrealm.com/images/rb.gif http://www.usflag.org/animate/flagwave1.gif "Your right to swing your fist ends where my nose begins." |
Dammit - too computer illiterate to use smilies!
Basically I think that US foreign intervention has been governed for a while by a wish of global capital to further their own markets. This has been done time and again at the expense of people across the globe, all the while being justified to Americans and the Western powers in general by describing it as humanitarian or similar. But that is the system we live under - it sucks and it might change someday, but it is not going to do so any time soon. This would finish with something cheesy and sentimental but I can't figure out how to do that. Damn! Damn! Damn! ------------------ Life is like a piece of cheese. Mice only enjoy it in cartoons and it is better with toast |
For those of you who have expressed feelings of intimidation by the size of our country, try seeing us as 50 gnomes standing in a huddle. http://www.ironworksforum.com/ubb/no...miles/wink.gif
America is a Superpower because: Other nations say it is so. I think the other nations that have set this country in the front seat as world police do so because they won't risk their own to do it themselves. (Please everyone, try not to take that statement so offensively, it is my opinion) I see it as both a good and a bad thing because we are held up by others for our position out in front, however I do believe that when we take a fall, no one will rush forward to catch us. I can even see fingers being pointed at us saying we had it coming, that it was inevitable, etc. Well, with no one else in action with us, it will be inevitable, but will we deserve it? For doing what others don't want to? Who will watch their backs then? Who is second in line to be first and why do we have to line up anyway?! http://www.ironworksforum.com/ubb/no.../hollering.gif :leaving lid off of can of worms: http://www.ironworksforum.com/ubb/no...miles/wink.gif ------------------ http://members.aol.com/lasttrueprincess/images/ltp4.gif The best thing about karma is that you create your own. Pets Need Love Too |
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That's why I love you so! http://www.ironworksforum.com/ubb/no...es/biggrin.gif ------------------ Still The Most Humbly Prideful (?) Member Of The Illuminati! Mark |
Moni - I am so glad that that post had a due sense of good humour as other wise I would have been very pissed off!
1st point: As a Brit it is a little difficult to see how the US has always acted alone and how we will not help if you fall. Remember that there are British and German troops in Afghanistan with you there - whether or not the British people like it as Parliament has not been given a vote on the issue. Also remember that your role as world policeman in WW2 was a good 2 years behind ours and france's. Not that the help wasn't appreciated (would put some kind of smily in here - wee earlier post). 2nd point: Surely one thing that can be learned and acted on from this whole mess is that there are a lot of people who disagree with the American publics view of its own foreign policy. The actions that America has taken are ultimatley self motivated and self serving for the most part. It is often played upon how America is the greatest nation in the world. It has had to work hard to keep itself there over the last few years and a lot of people are starting to wonder why they are still doing it. Fukuyama wrote 11 years ago that we had experienced the end of history - this is sadly showing that it is only the beginning... Taking the can of worms and throwing it all over the people in the forum, hoping that they don't start to be pissed off... ------------------ Life is like a piece of cheese. Mice only enjoy it in cartoons and it is better with toast |
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It is a great comfort to know that you are so caring about everything and everyone and that you are someone I can call my friend! Many Hugs & Much Love To You! http://www.ironworksforum.com/ubb/no...s/EEhearts.gif ------------------ http://members.aol.com/lasttrueprincess/images/ltp4.gif The best thing about karma is that you create your own. Pets Need Love Too |
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The U.S. is obviously not the only country to ever take action, but it seems to me that in recent decades, we have always been first, where there are others who could have helped that were much closer to the situation(s) but didn't. Believe me, I am grateful that Britain and German troops are standing by as U.S. allies, but we can all be sure that they too have vested interests in the whole outcome of the situation, which leads me to addressing your point #2. Just because I live in this country does not mean that I embrace all of its policies, nor should any foreigner kid themselves into thinking that every American does. I won't deny that America or any other country in existence is self-serving and Bush is at the top of my list of legal thieves, but notice that we are not the only ones, nor is it a concept we created on our own...we did used to be part of your country! If America IS the greatest nation in the world it is because everyone has said so to a point where everyone believes it, or at least expects it to be out front. Tell the new kid how great he is and you can get him to do anything for you for as long as you treat him with respect right? Push the responsibilities off on someone else so that you can stay out of trouble...this has been a concept of mankind ever since money came into play in life. Personally, I am sitting back and waiting for the "One world, one people" days when we can all play on the same playground without having to worry about who has the shiniest marbles! http://www.ironworksforum.com/ubb/no...es/biggrin.gif http://www.ironworksforum.com/ubb/no...iles/frown.gif I have to go...our puppy is sick and I need to get the place ready for him to be brought home. http://www.ironworksforum.com/ubb/no...iles/smile.gif See you later! http://www.ironworksforum.com/ubb/no...es/xyxwave.gif ------------------ http://members.aol.com/lasttrueprincess/images/ltp4.gif The best thing about karma is that you create your own. Pets Need Love Too |
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All nations act for the same self-serving reasons reasons. I can't think of a nation in exist today or in world history that didn't act for these very reasons. America isn't being selfish, instead America is acting in it's own best interest. Nations choose to be allies for the same reasons. Nation A & Nation B aren't allies because they want to take care of the other, they become allies because they see the benefits they reap from such an alliance. Long term alliances begin to seem like friendships, but in reality, nations stay in alliances because they both benefit. ------------------ http://www.wizardrealm.com/images/rb.gif http://www.usflag.org/animate/flagwave1.gif "Your right to swing your fist ends where my nose begins." [This message has been edited by Ronn_Bman (edited 10-29-2001).] |
Hmmm, bit of a misunderstanding about what I meant I am afraid my dragonlike friend. I personally think that your vision of a world playground is very likely, but not all that soon (as you would probably agree, current situation noted). But in terms of economics we already are moving towards one world. That is the inevitable pull of capitalism - it eventually destroys what it created to protect itself = countries. See my earlier post about countries being essentially artificial anyway. They are being destroyed slowly now, and all for the better as far as the majority of the world is concerned. The major barriors in todays society are the ones between rich and poor and they transcend national limits. People are pissed with America because it does commit legal theivery (v cool term by the way), not necessarily as a country but thruough the companies it harbours. If any of this makes sense to anyone here then I will be quite surprised as I am very tired...
By the way - you may be pleased about UK troops in Afghanistan but I am not. I personally don't like to think that troops supposedly defending my country are attacking another without my consent. Maybe I am a bit unrealistic in that sense. Hope the puppy is ok. ------------------ Life is like a piece of cheese. Mice only enjoy it in cartoons and it is better with toast |
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I can see it coming, but it is going to involve a lot of change and a lot of grief for all involved what with people (esp Americans) having to give up certain rights that they feel are "God Given." Our forefathers had good intentions, but themselves were capitalizing on what was here and what was to come, giving those with money equal opportunity. http://www.ironworksforum.com/ubb/no...miles/wink.gif I agree with you about the companies this country harbors that do commit legal thievery on a world-wide level and it is reason to be ashamed but those with no conscious don't feel it and those with no power over it can do anything about it. Those with authority are being bought off and all of us suffer in the end. I doubt we are alone in the world with this, but we are the most popular huh? Can you imagine a world where money was never conceived? I asked my room-mate this not long ago and he said something about just having a bartering system, to which I replied, not even that...just people, living on the planet with no concept of riches, just of surviving and assisting others in their own survival. It was a possibility at one time very long ago. Whoever said money was the root of all evil sure knew what he was talking about! I am sorry it stresses you that your own troops are involved. I don't like conflict myself, but I do believe in a swift end to fights that others want to start, if you know what I mean. Thanks for your well wishes for the pup. His getting to come home means he is going to live. It was touch and go last night but he is on his way home as I write. I need to go and make sure I get some homework done now LOL. I get little to no rest some days! Anyway, you take care & I'll be back later today or maybe tomorrow...hmm, come to think about it, I have a big (5 chapter) test in Gov't. on Wednesday so you might not see me here again until Thursday if I don't make it back later. I really need to study up for this one! Peace, Love & Hugs, http://www.ironworksforum.com/ubb/no...s/EEhearts.gif Moni ------------------ http://members.aol.com/lasttrueprincess/images/ltp4.gif The best thing about karma is that you create your own. Pets Need Love Too |
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wow I'm feeling like cheap humor today, so I thought I'd paraphrase miss Moiraine since I agree with her. http://www.ironworksforum.com/ubb/no...iles/smile.gif The US is a porn star while most countries won't shower in the lockerroom http://www.ironworksforum.com/ubb/no...miles/wink.gif The same type of comparison goes on in both places. Most people don't state it out loud, but it happens nevertheless. ------------------ http://www.wizardrealm.com/images/prime.gif "Life is what happens while you are busy making other plans." - Lennon |
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A place where money did not exist.... could be possible, but the population would be tiny and the lifespan would be very short. There is no way that this country could support 200 million people with no money. Most of them would starve. The old hunter/gatherers are the closest I can think of to a society with no money, and even they bartered at times. |
IMO you are a super power because you - quite simply posess more economical, political, military etc. power than any other single nation in the world. In other words: Because yours is bigger than mine!
The art here is to be able to administer that power in a way that, ideally, would make everyone (yourself and those around you) happy. Realistically in a way that would p**s the least number of people or nations off. Before the 11/9, if asked about my own opinion on this, I would most likely sound no different from christians generalising on muslims, muslims generalising on christians, arabs generalising on jews and vice cersa, you may continue this list ad lib... But semi-lurking on this and the other IW forums and a general rising alertness about the world around me has, if not convinced me, then at least helped me to a much more nuanced view of the world as a whole, and the U.S. of A in particular. (I promised myself not to mention the muppet in charge, but now I went and did it anyway - sorry!) Anyway - nice to hear honest opinions on either side from you guys. We tend to only get the more extreme views (either pro war or against) from the media. Even, or maybe especially, in the UK. A good night to everyone, be ye friend or foehttp://www.ironworksforum.com/ubb/no...iles/smile.gif |
Gil - you were writing that at 3 in the morning? Ouch...
As for Moni's society without money it is very possible although,like the world playground, not right now. The hunter gatherers were only able to support a small number of people as they did not have the technological advances we do today. They didn't know about farming for example. People often get confused about this and think that a society without money has to be like the hunter gatherers in every way - what if we just use what we have but abolish money. Just because we have no money doesn't mean we have to forget farming and fishing techniques. The society with money is deeply entrenched in peoples minds - that is why it will be with us for a while. We have lived our every moment in it and can't see an alternative working. Any excuse is used to support the shaky system we live under - it is human nature, it is the only system possible, it is the only system that doesn't infringe human liberties. All of these are often said without any actual thought as to what they might mean. As a result they are all said often in error. Hopefully one day the world will realise that it is being taken for a ride by a small few - but it probably won't be for a while. ------------------ Life is like a piece of cheese. Mice only enjoy it in cartoons and it is better with toast. |
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