It started for me with GW's endorsement of Israeli settlements - those ones that are so contentious. The case that they have been there so long now that they should be considered permanent looks a little flimsy to me though, and sure to inflame the situation.

And this afternoon Bin Laden offers a truce to Europe.

A fairly large news day.

Why is there no "disbelief" smiley?

I read it too, about Bin Laden's truce. Think we should accept ? :D

What - get Europe to agree on something johnny???

No - while I don't think war can prove an effective deterrent to terrorism, appeasement to demands has never been shown to work either.

Well, I think this does wonders to show Bin Laden's conviction to his ideals. :rolleyes: F-tard. I hope his bloody turban gets displayed in a museum near me when this is all through. Spoiled rich brat mysogenist decides to use daddy's money to convince others to kill themselves in the name of religious zealotry. I don't exactly respect him.

*in mad-scientist voice*
Excellent! The Magik-metamorphosis is complete. All voids must be filled... ;)

Hey, Heirophant, I'm feeling generous today, so have 2 of these. [img]graemlins/finger.gif[/img]

Here's the NY Times article. The quotes below are from it.

And, taking a cue from Kerry, OBL crawls out of his hole long enough to flip-flop about. I actually like this, because it shows his convictions are weaker than my hedonist infidel president's convictions. I always knew Texans were more stalwart than any of those ■■■■■ extremists.

These people need a serious talking to. Knowing which office received the tape would help pinpoint OBL. I think they need to be interrogated further, at gun point and with hot pokers. They can give up this info, journalistic integrity be damned. Pass me the thumbscrews.

See, it's the simple lessons we forget. But, you can't tell this to Europe. OBL knows they'd rather talk and negotiate a problem to death rather than get off their namby pamby asses and actually do something.

[img]graemlins/biglaugh.gif[/img] Yeah, the demarcation line is real clear. Forget other acts of terrorism aimed against America. They don't like infidels, and that's that.
Sorry, but the bloodletting has begun. I say let it flow freely until there is a resolution. It is us or them, folks, we cannot coexist with terrorists. Luckily, we are able to kill them faster than they kill us.

These days I'm all for nuking the entire region, cordoning it off with yellow tape, and making it a wasteland uninhabitable by humans -- at least then it won't be a frikkin headache.


And, Heirophant, NOW the transformation is complete. :D [img]graemlins/finger.gif[/img]

Perhaps people need to stop talking trash about others who aren't around to defend themselves anymore, it's a little immature.

See, it's the simple lessons we forget. But, you can't tell this to Europe. OBL knows they'd rather talk and negotiate a problem to death rather than get off their namby pamby asses and actually do something.

[/QB]</font>[/QUOTE]Oh dear Timber. History teaches us that you always have to negotiate with terrorists or their representatives eventually. Gerry Adams, Martin McGuinness, Menachem Begin, Nelson Mandela, Archbishop Makarios.

Can you give me an example of a case where terrorists have been beaten by might alone?

That doesn't mean you have to negotiate with Osama bin Laden of course.

heh heh. Aww c'mon man. S'all in good fun [img]smile.gif[/img]

Further thoughts on OBL's love letter to the EU bluebloods.

Two fallacies in one sentence: (1) it's the terrorist who are "warmongers," actually trying to impede the US from simply helping a nation have freedom and build hospitals, and (2) OBL don't represent Islam.
Again, we can play the tit-for-tat game, too. It ain't one incident. The unwashed shoot-guns-in-air groups have been terrorising people for years. Arafat was once a young man -- and he was militant. It may not be him, but when I look at OBL I see the same type of man who shoots a man in a wheelchair and tosses him into the sea. Except OBL's a lot better at running and hiding.

Wait, erm... syntax error does not compute. Israel killed Yassin so the terrorists will take revenge on the US? OBL needs some remedial logic classes.
Boy, what to do here? I think it's just a good excuse to hate non-muslims. It's certainly a problem that's been facing the region for 3000 or more years. There were just a LOT of militant peoples who developed in the area. Israel had the misfortune of living along their trade routes, but generally it's been one heck of a ride for the region. Can we preserve all these peoples and ethnicities and countries and cultures into the future? Should we? With so many militant cultures clashing in one spot, logic dictates that some must die out, doesn't it?

Okay then, forget i mentioned it. :D

**shudder** Just reading that makes me feel dirty. I hope there's another model to this thing.

**shudder** Just reading that makes me feel dirty. I hope there's another model to this thing. </font>[/QUOTE]I agree it's disgusting - it's a bitter pill. I hated the idea of negotiating with the IRA.

To get over it we rewrite history.

You *are* talking about bin Laden here, right?

Yes, I am. I'd have to take out the mysogenist (sp??) bit and replace "use daddy's money to convince others to kill themselves" with "use daddy's money to get elected so he can [insert insult]" if I were talking about that other paragon of evil -- which is your reference, of course.

[ 04-15-2004, 11:36 AM: Message edited by: Timber Loftis ]

Be clear - Bin Laden wasn't offering a truce to Europe, he was offering a truce to adolescent (new) Europe.

He doesn't consider himself to be at war with mature Europe - although these countries with the older, more experienced and sensible leaders will continue to try to track him down regardless of his attitudes towards them.

How do you know whom he considers himself at war with ? Have you spoken with him lately ? From what i've seen and heard from him in his taped messages he's at war with everyone who's an infidel in his book, and that includes 90% of Europe. Plus he also has a problem with faithful muslims, who don't agree with his point of view. That's what i understand from his messages.

Spain isn't "Old Europe?" If so, you really need to help out the folks who write history books.

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Because he stated it without any ambiguity:
"I also offer a reconciliation initiative to them, whose essence is our commitment to stopping operations against every country that commits itself to not attacking Muslims or interfering in their affairs - including the US conspiracy on the greater Muslim world.

This reconciliation can be renewed once the period signed by the first government expires and a second government is formed with the consent of both parties.

The reconciliation will start with the departure of its last soldier from our country."

Since 'old europe' doesn't have any troops based in the middle-east and is not at war with middle-eastern countries, the message is clearly not meant for them.
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Aznar is an adolescent european but is fortunately being replaced by a more mature leader [img]smile.gif[/img] , so Spain will soon lose that title. Now, if only my own country could gain a comparable leader to the new Spanish one, the world would be a lot safer...
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