I just got word that 50,000 Christians are trapped in Sulawesi, Indonesia. The word is they are about to be massacred by Islamic extremist fanatics.

Those who do should pray. Those who don't - spread the word.

Yorick- praying here. Where did you see /hear this news?!

Cloudy

OMG!

Oh damn :( , I pray for them....

HOLY JESUS! Where did you hear this. Why isn't someone stopping them?

<blockquote>quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by Yorick:
I just got word that 50,000 Christians are trapped in Sulawesi, Indonesia. The word is they are about to be massacred by Islamic extremist fanatics.

Those who do should pray. Those who don't - spread the word.<hr></blockquote>

Oh, Yorick! That is dreadful!

Where did you get the info? I must go find a news bulletin....

Well, I don't pray, but I'm gonna spread the word, that really is awful news.

I cant find a thing about this...? Anyone have a line on this? Are these people missionarys?

I am kind of skeptical about posts like this, Where are these 50,000 people being held? how are they planning on exterminating so many people all at once? do they plan a mass grave? or will they let the bodies rot...while it isnt impossible to execute 50,000 people, it is rather hard logisticly to round them all up...then you have to do soemthing with the bodies...I wouldnt get too upset untill there is more cooberative evidence.

Just listened to a UK Radio Newsreel and there was nothing about it at all.
Maybe it is just a rumour Yorick heard? I certainly hope so.
I, too, was wondering how 50,000 people could be held hostage/massacred...

Was it maybe a threat made by a radical group to kill the 50,000 Christians there?

I had some Indonesian and Malay students in Singapore tonight, all of whom recieved anxious text messages from various people. The trouble has been brewing for months apparently. This is not an isolated incident from a particularly militant group.

All were very worried.

I too, when I heard, looked to see if media were covering it. Of course it's Sulawesi. If it was in Belgium it would be a different story.

I found none so I posted here. We are a source of information sharing. If it turns out to be false, I'd be more than relieved. Egg on face would be wonderful.

If true, I'd hope international awareness - and quick - would do something to prevent it. Pressure on Megawati to curtail the more radicaly violent movements in her nation.

<blockquote>quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by MagiK:
I am kind of skeptical about posts like this, Where are these 50,000 people being held? how are they planning on exterminating so many people all at once? do they plan a mass grave? or will they let the bodies rot...while it isnt impossible to execute 50,000 people, it is rather hard logisticly to round them all up...then you have to do soemthing with the bodies...I wouldnt get too upset untill there is more cooberative evidence.<hr></blockquote>

Don't know. I posted only what was passed on to me. I don't know what "trapped" means. I don't know the timeline.

Some of the guys here reacted with forlorn acceptance, as Sulawesi has apparently had trouble for a while now. They condemned Megawati as "doing nothing".

Others were gravely concerned.

As they believed it, so do I. They know this area, it's politics and it's events better than I do.

yikes... but then 50,000 peeps are enough to start a stampede and crush the bad guys out right? nah, if it were true they probably would have cannons and stuff...

if memory serves me right, it is similar to the inquisition, but i think those were jews not christians(or was it jesuits? bah)... and that was a massacre also... :(

This is the only thing I could find on the situation:

http://www.cnn.com/2001/WORLD/asiapc...ops/index.html

<blockquote>quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by MagiK:
I am kind of skeptical about posts like this, Where are these 50,000 people being held? how are they planning on exterminating so many people all at once? do they plan a mass grave? or will they let the bodies rot...while it isnt impossible to execute 50,000 people, it is rather hard logisticly to round them all up...then you have to do soemthing with the bodies...I wouldnt get too upset untill there is more cooberative evidence.<hr></blockquote>

Well they really don't have to kill the people, just threatening to do it may be enough..
At least I hope so :(

Thanks,Argus, for that link! I had heard of the unrest down that way and am not surprised to hear that Yorick's students are getting msgs from home about the conditions being worse. It sounds very much like a hotbed of hate and distrust and hopefully it can be contained and no more lives lost. :(


Cloudy

<blockquote>quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by Yorick:


Don't know. I posted only what was passed on to me. I don't know what "trapped" means. I don't know the timeline.

Some of the guys here reacted with forlorn acceptance, as Sulawesi has apparently had trouble for a while now. They condemned Megawati as "doing nothing".

Others were gravely concerned.

As they believed it, so do I. They know this area, it's politics and it's events better than I do.<hr></blockquote>

Sorry Yorik I didnt mean to sound like I doubted you..I didn't what I ment to indicate that I had my doubts about the veracity of the infop itself. I realize what you were trying to do...and just ment that people here shouldnt panic before we find out more.....again I apologize.

<blockquote>quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by Bahamut:
yikes... but then 50,000 peeps are enough to start a stampede and crush the bad guys out right? nah, if it were true they probably would have cannons and stuff...

if memory serves me right, it is similar to the inquisition, but i think those were jews not christians(or was it jesuits? bah)... and that was a massacre also... :( <hr></blockquote>

The Inquisition was not just jews, it was anyone the "mother church" and her representatives had a beef with, they even started going after normal businesses if they didnt give enough in kickbacks, Royals were "encouraged" to buy "special dispensations" so that their sins would not count against them...was a dark dark chapter for the Roman Catholic church.

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Argus:
This is the only thing I could find on the situation:

http://www.cnn.com/2001/WORLD/asiapc...ops/index.html[/Q UOTE]

Hm. Having read that report it looks like both christians and muslims are just fighting each other... no one engaged in general massacre.... but probably Yorick's info is more up to date.

<blockquote>quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by Fljotsdale:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Argus:
[qb]This is the only thing I could find on the situation:

http://www.cnn.com/2001/WORLD/asiapc...ops/index.html[/Q UOTE]

Hm. Having read that report it looks like both christians and muslims are just fighting each other... no one engaged in general massacre.... but probably Yorick's info is more up to date.[/QB]<hr></blockquote>

Or would we rather believe that Christians are being victimised rather than havinga part in the violence...
Just a thought, Fljotsdale. Violence has been simmering in that area for years. Even last Christmas there were reports of Christian/Muslim clashes and violence. Living in the region surrounded by Muslim countries, I only pray it doesnt spill over into Singapore. That could get ugly, really fast.

If its true then I am certainly praying.

<blockquote>quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by Lifetime:


Or would we rather believe that Christians are being victimised rather than having a part in the violence....<hr></blockquote>


Well the Indo Christians I know are about as likely to be violent as a lamb is likely to attack a pitt bull.

The two guys who were living here this week (gone home now) were from Medan. They had their church burnt down by arsonists. They were here to try and get finance to rebuild it.

If they retaliated and burnt down a Mosque it would be sheer suicide. Muslims vastly outnumber any other faith in Indonesia.

Aside from which, they hold to the teachings of Christ regarding nonagression.

By CNN's Atika Shubert in Jakarta

JAKARTA, Indonesia (CNN) -- Indonesian Chief Security Minister, Bambang Yudhoyono, toured Central Sulawesi Wednesday to make an assessment of the conflict between Christians and Muslims in the area that has killed at least seven people and made thousands homeless in the last week.

However, his visit was marred by tensions among community leaders.

Religious leaders from the mainly Christian town of Tentena refused to go to the Muslim-controlled district capital of Poso to meet with Minister Yudhoyono.

"Last night a church - one of only 2 remaining churches in Poso - was burned down just 100 meters from where the police and government offices are," Reverend Arnold Tobondo told CNN from his offices in Tentena.

"How could we go there and be expected to feel safe?" he said.

"Instead, a helicopter is taking the minister around to see the devastation caused by these terrorist attacks. So that he can see the real facts, the real destruction."

During his meetings with community leaders and government officials, Minister Yudhoyono discussed a 6-month plan to restore security to the area involving the deployment of 2 battalions of security forces.

According to the minister, the first 2 months will be used to quell violence while the remaining 4 months will monitor reconciliation between the two sides.

Yudhoyono also promised to disarm rival militias and deport recruits brought from outside the area to fight.

Laskar Jihad
Religious violence in Poso has simmered for more than a year, killing hundreds. The violence follows a similar conflict in the neighboring Maluku islands that has killed thousands of people.

After a particularly brutal Christian militia attack last year, 2 military battalions were called in to restore order.

Last week, however, violence flared again. This time, Christian groups blame the arrival of Indonesia's largest Muslim militant group, the Laskar Jihad or Jihad Army.

The group doesn't deny the charge.

Laskar Jihad has already trained and sent hundreds to fight in the Maluku islands. They now openly campaign to send volunteers to fight in Poso.

The Laskar Jihad website offers a three page explanation for their Poso campaign as well as a list of their "victories" in the area.

"The oppression of Muslims is what is spurring Laskar Jihad to descend into Poso's conflict," the explanation reads. "Laskar Jihad openly declares a jihad."

"Muslims must know that the best solution to resolving the Poso conflict is only through jihad."

'Al-Qaeda Links'
Christian groups accuse Laskar Jihad of being a terrorist organization that receives training and funding from Osama bin Laden's Al-Qaeda group.

Church leaders say the group is carrying out a plan to "cleanse" all Christians from the Poso area in time for the Muslim holiday of Idul Fitri on December 16 marking the end of Ramadan.

U.S. officials have alluded to the possibility of Al-Qaeda cells in Indonesia but Indonesian officials say that no concrete evidence has been found.

Information from suspected Al-Qaeda suspects on trial in Spain last month indicated the existence of a terrorist training camp in Indonesia.

Police in Indonesia have denied any evidence of the camp.

Laskar Jihad founders admit to meeting with Al-Qaeda members but deny receiving any training or funding from the terrorist group.

I really hope that last bit of information proves to be incorrect.

:(

omg... cleanse... :(

One of my students is a most beautiful Indonesian Christian young woman. So full of joy, sunlight, creative spark, encouragement, musical talent and love. To think of her smiling face being included amongst people this group wants to "cleanse" the area of, fills me with profound sorrow.

These aren't just faceless masses for me. But people like some of my students. I find any claims of Christian agression very hard to swallow when looking at all those I've met. They are exceptional ambassadors for their country and their faith.

This is awful.

I've recieved no further word. I've been checking with them, and there's been no word either way. :(

<blockquote>quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by MagiK:


The Inquisition was not just jews, it was anyone the "mother church" and her representatives had a beef with, they even started going after normal businesses if they didnt give enough in kickbacks, Royals were "encouraged" to buy "special dispensations" so that their sins would not count against them...was a dark dark chapter for the Roman Catholic church.<hr></blockquote>

thanks for saying that... its why i hate the churchs so much... i studied this, but i forgot that.. hehehehe pay to redeem yourself of your sins... stupid.

<blockquote>quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by Bahamut:


thanks for saying that... its why i hate the churchs so much... i studied this, but i forgot that.. hehehehe pay to redeem yourself of your sins... stupid.<hr></blockquote>

I agree. :mad:

<blockquote>quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by 250:
omg... cleanse... :( <hr></blockquote>

Yeah, no kidding. :( This is definitely something worth keeping an eye on. I'm sorry that this effects you as much as it does. Me being a few thousand miles away, it is to imagine what you have to be prepared for everyday.

I actually did a google search on the Laskar Jihad and found quite a few websites. Tons of pictures of mass graves and like the article I posted said, they were kind of bragging about what they have accomplished so far. Sad. [img]graemlins/verysad.gif[/img]

I can't believe this! Just when you think you have a handle on all the messed up crap going on, you hear something else. Some other way that this war is spreading. Truthfully, I'm starting to get a little nervous. Not conspiracy nut nervous, watchfull nervous.

i don't know if its me, but i always have this feeling that muslims have the wrong definition of Jihad and to think its their own religion?

how the hell can you use the temr Jihad when it is not a threat to the religion itself. it is against terrorism okay, maybe in this case its a little different. petty arguments don't instantly result to Jihad and all that. many muslim scholars loathe our terrorist groups here and other terrorists who use this term because it their reasons have not even passed the true definition of it! they should have used that before when Christians were doing what they did and not now on where everybody is trying to live in peace and all that