Serious question. We can agree that the 1st world are the westernised democracies and I think we all know what we mean when we talk about a 3rd world country but I've never been clear about the 2nd world.

Any thoughts?

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2nd world Was The communist world
So Sovjet Union Eastern Europe
China

1st and 2nd world are no longer used
But the 3rd world is

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Why do you bring this subject up anyway?
has this anything to do with my post about the "First World" having no capital punishment except USA?

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I always thought that the 2nd world were the old Warsaw Pact countries.

I don't think these groupings are used anymore - You have FDC (Fully Developed Countries), LDC (Least Developed Countries) and something else in between.

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Good Point... never figured that out, myself!! LOL

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Correct me if i'm wrong but weren't All Communist country's except China part of the Warsaw pact?

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Very likely Rikard, I wondered if Japan was a First World country. When I get a question like this in my head it won't go away without an answer.

BTW - you've contradicted yourself, in your previous post you said First World isn't used any more but you've just reminded me that you used it yesterday http://www.tgeweb.com/cgi-bin/ubb/no...iles/smile.gif

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I used it between "these things"
so it's not used but ehm erm used http://www.tgeweb.com/cgi-bin/ubb/no...s/confused.gif

To be honest i haven't thought about that whole first world second world thing untill the Whole McVeigh/Capital Punishment debate

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Virtually all of Eastern Europe was the Warsaw Pact. The Warsaw Pact was more of a military organization than a political one - it was basically the Soviet satellite states that acted as a buffer between the USSR and NATO. Other Communist nations that were not part of the Warsaw Pact were Cuba and some of the Marxist regimes in Africa.

Thinking about it now, I'm not sure if the 2nd World included China or not...I have a feeling that they (the economists that came up with this stuff) were thinking more of state-based industrial communist economies at the time - China would have been an agricultural-based economy back in the late 40s and early 50s.

I could be wrong though, it's been 10 years since I studied this. http://www.tgeweb.com/cgi-bin/ubb/no...iles/smile.gif

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i think they base it on economic progress or something... we are called a 'third world' country.. or maybe colonization?

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If I remember correctly the 'definitions' for 1st, 2nd, 3rd world are:

1st world: Fully industrialized and technologically advanced, privatized industry, independent and stable currency
2nd world: Making the transition between state owned and privatization. Therefore most of the Eastern European countries are catagorized here. Also most of these countries have an independent currency, but it is 'pegged' to an outside currency (i.e. dollar or pound)
3rd world: Very little or no industry (i.e. agriculture based), a currency that is worthless or nonexistant (an outside currency is used or a barter system is used, a chicken for a bag of rice http://www.tgeweb.com/cgi-bin/ubb/no...iles/smile.gif)

These are 'rough' definitions but they should help http://www.tgeweb.com/cgi-bin/ubb/no...les/ponder.gif


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I thought the emphasis was more on the industrial bias (primary/secondary/tertiary) than anything else, but I suppose, ultimately, it's a subjective term based loosely on all the factors mentioned

Now, this is going back some years as I graduated with a degree in International Relations in 1990 but...

IIRC, the term Third World was coined by a french chap (Les Tiers Monde if my french is still up to it) in the post war period. I'm not sure that he explicitly defined a First and Second world, though I'm sure the implicit definitions are as above.

There was always some problems defining these zones though due to anomalies such as Saudi Arabia, As Memnoch has already said the term LDC (Less Developed Countries) was used for a while, as was UDC (Under Developed Countries) but these things tend to be fairly fashionable. In fact, I think I've heard the term Fourth World used with regards to SE Asian "tiger" economies in the 1980s.

Apologies for my crap memory.

btw, Yugoslavia was one Eastern European country that wasn't in the Warsaw pact due to a fall out between Stalin and Tito. Hence they developed a system where the main army was mostly cadre with the bulk of fighting forces being local militias trained and equiped (with locally stored weapons) for guerilla warfare, in case the Warsaw pact did invade. Does anyone see the potentail pitfalls in this arrangement?

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Thank you Moridin for refreshing my memory... I used to know that when I was in college... but sadly, it has been a while. And thank you also, Billikins the Bold, for pointing out things that I had skimmed over in class, i.e. the origins of the term and such. Ah such dry facts that now seem a little more pertinent.

Funny how they term the 1st - 3rd worlds in terms of economics... I think were we to look at social advancement, the countries would fall in a much different order. http://www.tgeweb.com/cgi-bin/ubb/no...es/biggrin.gif

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Wandering Soul - Finding my life's calling is Bodhisattva
Looking for lost brain - I left it only for a moment....and there it goes... rolling under the table!!
Noticing that the Light has gotten further down a Dark Tunnel than expected... Time to get the Lantern... Knowing sooner or later - I will get to the End of this Tunnel to the Open Air once again...