For me personally, the ultimate computer game would be one where each character in a gaming world is represented by an online computer gamer. When the person logs on, it would be like being born, you would recieve certain skills and abilities (perhaps even forms and alignments) that were unique and unalterable. Now, the programmers could ensure you weren't too pathetic/buff, but it would allow a unbelievable degree of involvement and interaction. It would mean incrediblie playability since you would evolve in a way no one else could and so if you joined a group would allow infinite diversity and enjoyment. It would basically be mirror of the real world in a fantasy environment. Could you imagine a game where, when you approached a character and they spoke, it was someone typing online, creating quests in their imagination. Or perhaps real happenings e.g. player logs on, gets a priest character, but no temple. Needs cash to finance set up, so pays you to rob another player etc. The world would be a dynamic and would allow play that was real and realistic. The quests would not be created but a neceesity. The repercussions would alter the environment and people in it e.g. a poor(er) merchant a new temple and

I know Ultima is an attempt to do this, but I mean to go one step further, a world where everything is player. no set quests etc. it would have to develop a personality of its own. Player might even get 'online born' as a dragon etc. What do you think.

That would be an awesome game. It would be even better with no load times. you could just go whever you want and not have to see please wait till game loads. It would have to be a HUGE world. Who knows we may see a game like that real soon...

I have always wanted to design a futuristic war RPG like that, where you would start off as a basic grunt taking orders from a higher level player and working your way up, as you get further up the ladder, you get to design the missions for others to follow, going on to team leader then general of a few teams and so on choosing whether or not to take part in them yourself, people could even design their own weapons and submit them. even open a shop and sell them, You could leave your team and go renegade, or become a traitor basically do anything you like....

I dont think that they have the technology as yet, but in the future, Who knows

[This message has been edited by Magog (edited 06-29-2001).]

Well the concept isn't new, but for RPG's it would be.

The best (and my personal favorite) of what you are suggesting is the "Wing Commander" series of space combat titles. There are games where you manage your own fleet tactics, one where you are a mercenary, and of course the standard storyline series that has been going on with movie-interludes now.

Right now there are actually alot of games that have tried to attempt this. I find the idea of the computer randomly choosing what who your characteris interesting, but some people prefer to create their own. If your interested in playing massive online games like this try Asherons Call or Everquest. Personaly Asherons call has to be my choice.

What I'm reallly into is the idea of a gameworld that is responsive to the characters in it (i.e. fluid not static.). So, cities evolve, ports grow etc. I'm not on about sim style games, but ones where you control a character who can do what they wish (rob, steal, establish businesses, quest whatever.) In this world, other characters will also be online players, who will behave in a similar manner. In a Baldurs world this could mean say, a player could log on, decide to become an adventurer. Perhaps another player is already there, who is an established shopkeeper. Perhaps the shopkeeper wants to get their hands on a particularly rare item and then pays the new adventurer to get the object. If the adventurer succeeds, shopkeeper profits etc. Perhaps adventurer decides to keep the good for themselves. Perhaps shopkeeper gets item and sells shop to become an adventurer themslelves and so on. This would require some guidance etc, in the form of seeding of items, gold resources and so on, but would allow some epic gameworld development. Everone could work within the environment to whatever end takes their fancy.

There are quite a few games like that. EverQuest, Anarchy Online, Asheron's Call, Ultima Online, etc.

Glycerine

Heh go check www.shadowbane.com it is going to be one good RGP game perhapas up there with baldur's gate II.

Far more races, classes, and other things then bg2 and ToB.
You get to (later) BE a minotaur! Cool stuff.
check it out at
www.shadowbane.com


------------------
Will the real cheesy lich stop using timestop, stop using time stop, YEAH BABY! :1diablo:

There used to be a really old (80's) rpg game that was purely word scripted (no graphics) that was very similar to what you are describing. It was on several campuses (University of Texas was where I first saw it in 91').

Everquest is very much like that ( i have a level 51 cleric there) but the game is designed to be a big time-waster.. lots of sitting, waiting, camping, it got tedious..

Anarchy online I think is the name of an upcoming futuristic online roleplaying, looks brilliant but still not certain if its achievable, there is going to be a Star Wars one.

------------------
http://www.facelink.com/edit/raw/raw...43/1922643.bmp

I like to play games "my" way. I dont like always having to fight a certain creature, just because its written in the script. Conversly, I would like to be able to kill innocents and Allys, if I choice. In short, I want my choices to matter, rather then just following a straight-line plot, with no real choices.

As good as BG2 is, you always start at A and finish at Z, always hitting B, C, and D, along the way.

There is a very old game called Dagerfall that will let you do this, dont know if I can reccomend it anymore. X beyond the frontier is a space sim do anything you want game. Ultimate Freedom is a problem because its pretty much unachievable if you want to debate this head over to www.pcgamer.co.uk and go into their forum on game ideas or something.

------------------
http://www.facelink.com/edit/raw/raw...43/1922643.bmp

I love Daggerfall. You can create your own character, it has a first person view, you don't have to follow the set quest. You can go off and do whatever you want. You can buy a house, a boat and travel in Daggerfall's imaginary world. The graphics though are really bad. If they could create a Daggerfall 2 w/ better graphics but the basic game idea I would get it in a second.

There was a sequal to Daggerfall it was called Battlespire and it was awful, there was also redguard bu that was more of tombraider rip off. they have another game coming up called morrowind and shock horror it has good graphics but is totally linear.

------------------
http://www.facelink.com/edit/raw/raw...43/1922643.bmp

That's too bad. I really liked to concept of Daggerfall. I knew about the sequals to Daggerfall, but they weren't like it.

"Ultimate Freedom is a problem because its pretty much unachievable"

Yes, but there has to be something between Ultimate freedom, and completely linear. Just put a couple of branchs on the linear story, making it possible to end up at a different conclusion. And dont have me facing a monster I can possibly kill, because he appears later in the story. Most of the big budget games are afraid to be anything but Linear (they spend lots of time and money on their story, so they make you go thru it ALL, in order). I think the whole story telling concept may be holding some games back. Maybe how we play the game, should be the story, rather than just grinding through text messages in point A to B to C. At least we could go from A, then maybe C, then B, if we like. BG does have some of this.

The subject line was "The Ultimate computer game", not "a good game".

I had daggerfall. Good concept, poor execution (it crashed all the time).

Daggerfall was way to big and clumsy, and with way too many pointless dungeons.

the idea you have is brilliant! imagine a player is born as a Dragon and creates a dungeon to live in, where he then gathers gold and equipment from other players that want his power http://www.tgeweb.com/cgi-bin/ubb/no...iles/smile.gif it could make such a legend!

Thanks for the positive feedback guys, I must say Shadowbane does look to be moving to where I'm talking about. What I really want is a game where your character evolves as the world does around them. Where every character you meet is a human thinker and not a pre-scripted AI. This will to continuous playability. a world online that develops according to human ideas and isn't hindered by default settings.

I'll say a tough duel between Everquest and Age of Kings

My main problem with the online games is, well honestly I dont see the point no storyline to drive it on just a lot of camping and playerkillers. I dont get the why people just turn up in something like Ultima online and spend their time nitting shirts for money or something pointless like that. Playing Quake is one thing but seriously. trying to give players freedom to what they want is onething but the next is what are they going to do and you end up with clunky game sandboxs like Daggerfall.



------------------
http://www.facelink.com/edit/raw/raw...43/1922643.bmp

don't you ev3er get bore with, here is the plot, nice and linear, please follow, wouldn't you like to come along and say, hey guys heres a big heap of cash, go get me this quest item (then follow them and ambush them as they return, muwahahhahaaa). Its the possibilities that attract. From what I here UO is fatally flawed by being too difficult to advance in (people being beaten to death by vicious bunny rabbits etc.)