Im sad to say that there are a few boring people out there who just pick the plain old fighter class and mock the bard.Have any of ye fools ever gone one.... if you do go a jester it may be the weakest bard in terms of melee combat but it is a true bard and has a nice bard song.

Bards are indeed a handy addition to your party. Although I prefer the Skald not the jester, the skald has a better song when he increases in level.

I don't have anything against most bards. Jesters actually aren't that bad, and one of my best friends is a skald. The bard kit I don't condone is the blade. Simply put, a bard is a bard, not a fighter. The blade loses out on both lore and thieving, and his warsong stinks (doesn't get any better with experience).

I play a blade. Why can't the bard be a fighter? A thief can be a fighter (swashbuckler). The blade is really the bardic form of Erol Flynn, performing awesome acts of derring do. You usually don't have more than one tough fight a day so he can use his spins on every fight. He is a very useful fighter-mage type when you mirror image and stone skin him and use his offensive spin (plus 2 attack/damage, one additional attack, faster movement, and maximum damage per hit). Also, the blade pickpockets as well as other bards (95% chance of success initially). Perhaps it will be fixed in a later patch.

"Wah Wah Wah" "Bards are good", wah wah wah. Yeah Bards are good, good at getting obliterated. I mean, what the hell is a Bard, he has crap spells, semi-speciallised thieving, and ok fighting. I mean why pick a "Jack of all Trades" when you can just pick a Druid and and mop the floor with and "Skald" or "Blade". Heh, and the Druid can find traps(which the Bard cant) , So much for a thief eh?

it's OK shank, I'm only here so there's no need to call me that many times. i only really have a bard on my team because i get him to memorise loads of protection from evils to cast on me whilst i prepare a gate spell - if he dies then too baaaaaaaad. also i gave him the pandemonium harp so he is really happy and doesn't die in battles more often.

Oh my, the anti-Bard gang is here. Time to crack some skulls.

Bards beat the hassle of waiting for your fighter-mage to get up high enough to get his old class back. A blade is awesome at melee. At my lowly stage in the game, I dual wield the sunfyre sword or the sword of roses and the flail of ages. I do not get touched if I wade into the enemy and go into a defensive spin and offensive spin simultaneously. Offensive spin is really a simulatenous casting of haste, beserker rage and Kai. If I'm stuck in the wrong place, I can use a wand or cast offensive spells. Money is not a problem. If I see a +2 shield I like, I pickpocket it, with a skill of 120% success. The only thing I can't get is stuff at the Adventurer's mart. If I am up for a big battle, I can go invis (if needed) and pickpocket the enemy and take away his giant strength potions and arrows and force them to melee. My AC can reach -19 at a mere level 10 with improved invisibility, spin and ghost armor. Strength can't go about 18/01? Pick up a girdle or use innate Holy Might to improve my strength to envious proportions. Then there are those occasional instruments that are the icing on the cake. Maybe my lore is not all that high but I don't have to waste spells identifying +2 daggers.
I may never get level 7 spells, but neither do most casters (not Aerie or Jan Jansen), and I will get plenty of 6 level spells early on. The blade is a challenge but turns fights into chessmatches and there are so many wages to dispose of my enemies.

doesn't that band bardot suck?
no-one out of australia or nz would know who they are...
anyway bardos name just reminded me of them

Sorry, but a dual thief/Mage will wipe away any Bard and be better at thieving and spells. As for fighting, try improved haste, Tenser's transformation, black blade of disaster, absolute immunity, any mantle spell, stoneskin etc and see who's better. And yes bards can cast some but not all these spells, but will take a lot longer to learn them. Or try a swashbucler/mage. It doesn't take long to dual as you should change at level 11, (220,000 EXP) to be able to reach the highest mage level and thus get level 9 spells, max 6 for Bards.


PS love simulacrum...

The true essence of a bard lies in group combat.Not 1 on 1 like a fighter.What im saying is that most classes are equal in groups, of course a fighter would beat a mage/bard/thief one on one but in group terms the bard is far more usefull than a fighter.If you develop the right strategy the bard can turn a losing battle around.People just mock the bard when they are creating a character.Ive tried all the classes and i found that the bard was the most fun to play with.Maybe you will too if you give the bard a chance.

For some reason, which remains a mystery to me, i like bards... to misquote sean connery in some movie or another, "i like bards, and don't like people who don't". ok, i butchered that quote, but as a professional bard, i think they are a very useful class, especially in tight places. the npc blade came in real handy in the final battle against irenicus, all 5 times that i chose to use him.

true bards can be very usefull and they save having to reform your party because either you have no mage or thief.I dont intend to get edwin but i will get jan hell fit in my party nicely because he has got good spells and good thieving and that my mage and thief taken care of id just have cernd ,minsc,korgan and keldornand that would be my party fo the rest of the game.

Sorry to say it but rather think Bards a re a luxery class
a class you would use if you had a space free or something
I played Bg1 with a bard in my group and found him to be a good fighter using Xbows and longswords and Large shields
I could very much use the low level spell f a bard to kill opponents of
BUT what you do miss in are the high level; spells i think the pickpocketing is just luxery
and think if i would have found more mages in bg1 i would have put away the bard

If you would have a party of 8 people or something you could use luxery classes like a Bard a druid and cleric instead of a ranger/cleric and a monk but that is not the case

BTW what i do have to say is
If Bg was real live i'd probably either be a bard or a mage

yeah same ere i do llike themage aswell they are the most fun classes to go with lets face it.If they combined the bard with a monk and took away the bards use of some weapons it would be the best class around.
And the bard has improved a lot since bg.

A lot of people look as bards as fighters who can identify with lore and cast some spells, and if you look at them that way then they will be a poor substitute for a fighter. Definitely not for powergamers but from a roleplaying point of view they can be very challenging. I'm about to start a game as a jester, just for the fun of it. Off topic from the thread, i also want to try out a totemic druid to see how that is.

No, bards are crap. The most useless class of all.

Furthermore, if your idea of fun role-playing is to be the court jester, you probably wear pink tights to bed and listen to Yanni while practicing playing the "flute". Gad, a party led by a bard? That is so far from my idea of fun in AD&D... In fact, when that class was introduced in 1981, even then I said "What's the point?".

Now the new Bards in IWD may be a vast improvement with many different types of "songs" and stuff. So I'll try one out there. But up till now, all the bards just suck.

I agree with Kael on one point, I would definitely be a Bard if I was living the Vida BGII. We all know bards would get all the chicks.
As to game play, I had a killer bard in Icewind. I restarted just so I could use one. I must admit, they require a higher level of game play. If you want a simple 'throw these 3 spells and swing away' type of gaming experience, stay away from the bard. If you want a realistic, colorful player character that requires some strategy and role-playing, have at it. I think you'll enjoy it.

The only problem with bards in the game are the fact that there are only three good mages and two (maybe three) thieves. With a bard as the PC in the party it is hard to balance the party:
You have to have Jan Jansen until you get Imoen
You have to have Nalia or the other guy...
Now you are very heavy in magic.
But you will want to keep both a druid and cleric in the party (Ok, maybe the druid is expendable because their weapon choices are so bad). This leaves you with only one tank. Maybe it's not so bad if you can rush to get Imoen.

Another problem is they messed up by offering the ring of human influence right away. They ought to make it a challenge if your PC doesn't have good charisma. And the eye glasses of identification, the fact it can be pickpocketed, really hurts the bard's usefulness.

The bard is absolutely the best choice to play as a main character, at least as a roleplaying point of view. At least I need a good reason for my character to wonder around and get to troubles. It's an imagination problem or something I quess..
Figter: just can't imagine my self as a brainless huge swordsman.
Mage: hm.. no.. I rather spend my time in some tower or castle than stomping around.
Thief: I don't want to be a full time criminal after all!
Ranger: why would I travel with bunch of geeks, when i could be alone in forest or something..
Paladin: ugh, sooo noble and booooring.
Druid: jeah, nature boy, right..
cleric/monk/jne. "no armor, no weapons, no nothing.."
A bard? Why yes, he's the guy who can't stay still and has to go wonder around and look for new things, troubles and all kind of cool stuff. Good charisma, some handy spells to aid in troubles, quick hands to steal if money runs out.. Perfect adventurer I think.

-hobs'da bard-

If you can't imagine yourself as a brainless swordsman, then dual one to a mage. Best of both worlds, and you can pretend to be smart and witty, like me. I've found fighter/mages and thief/mages to be a lot more effective than bards. Don't know about roleplaying, I'd prefer to be the uncaring, ale drinking, wealth obsessed journeyman than the flippant, lute-wielding... er... guy.

>Don't know about roleplaying, I'd prefer to be the uncaring, ale drinking, wealth obsessed >journeyman than the flippant, lute-wielding... er... guy

hmh.. Bard CAN also be an uncaring, WINE drinking journeyman, he's just a bit of more stylish and elegant than a rugged sworsdman who bashes himself through the happenings with raw power without thinking, killing everyone in sight.

-bards rules!

mmmmmmmmmmmmm!! all good points i like the bard the most cause of the
wave.He can now hold his own in a hard battle without using spells and wands.And when i use spells its usually in very difficult battles or when im bored.And i think the bard is the true person who doestnt give a shit about anything except making money and charming ladies.

Hello since i am currently in a good mood and since i like bards I am making a Harp of the Great Bard. And some other cool items. Any suggestions are welcome! Please give me some.

If a Bard really was any good, why aren't any famous people bard's??? Never heard of anyone in any realm who ever was a bard.......

Aegis

"Mors ultima linea rerum est"

Umm, William Shakespeare is commonly referred to as a bard. "Shakespeare in Love" is sort of a good example of the bard persona.

Anyone notice that most of the anti-Bard comments come from a certain Half Orc. Now, we all know how intelligent Half Orcs are, don't we?

Nothing 'stylish and elegant' about me, hobs. I wore a feathered hat down the street once and a pidgeon tried to mate with it. I can't help but see bards as too poncy for me to try and roleplay.

I'll bet if you called any member of Metallica a "bard", he would beat you to death, lol. Or they would have when their music didn't suck. And yes, Half-orcs may lack intelligence, but they are very good at killing - and eating - bards.

Going from town to town to woo women - wow, you use a game to do this? You all need to get out more. I don't play RPGs like this to woo women. I want to bash, cast fireballs, and backstab villians. I don't want to play a freaking harp.

As for Shakespear, waching his plays is entertaining, but in now way shape or form would I want this guy at my back in a fight. Gimme jackie chan - a funny "monk" - anyday.

Dear Half Orc, I see bard more like a gleeman than a court jester, traveling from city to city playing harp in taverns, makeing womens laugh and drinking lot's of wine. A bit like Robert Jordan books type of character, wearing patched cloak, carrying ton's of throwing knifes hidden under your shirt so that you can pull them out with flourish gesture, arousing envy all around you.. And ad G.W sayd, it's hard to get balance in your party with bard, true, but it also makes playing more interesting, challenging even. Besides, in Forgotten Realms, all heroic stuff is told by bards, so when lonely swordsman will die in silence, my dude writes he's own adventures down and he's name is rememberet for next millenium! ..he may become a BARDgod even, god of carousing and temptations
AND Metallica, for example, is a GROUP of bards! And they are richer than god himself..

-hobs-

This is a handy trick with the jester.Kill mencar pabblecrushers group in the den of the 7 vales and then on the thief there is a ring of invisibility.You can go invisible and play the bard song and just confuse your enemies and if you are high enough in level they'll start kickin the shit out of each other and eventually theyll be so weak the you yourslf can take em on hand to hand.(I think tHis also works with a cleric,)


P.S The half orc fella must be crazy,half orcs get none of the women and if they do look at their women ughhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh! its amusing to me to think about how the half orc race will continue /

DEAR BARDO (A.K.A MY NEIGHBOUR).I DONT UNDERSTAND HOW YOU CAN JABBER ON ABOUT TRYING OUT ALL CLASSES , USING THE WAVE ETC ETC WHEN YOU DONT EVEN OWN THE GAME BG2!!!!!!!!!YOU PLAY IT ON MY PC 2 OR 3 TIMES A WEEK AND ARENT EVEN PAST CHAPTER 2.LOL.......YOU ARE STILL AN AUTHORITY ON BG2 THOUGH ARENT YOU