Guys... I need your opinions please!

Ive got IWD and HoW installed (no TotLM yet) and ive finally got to the very end of the main game, but have not yet finished the final battle (Im not gonna mention names or places here in case it spoils it for somebody, lets just say that I am 100% sure that I am at the end because I have already had it spoiled for me!!).

Anyway - Ive just read NobleNick's comments elsewhere on the board about how the game is meant to be played and now Im confused as to what order I should be doing the remaining game sections in.

Should I delay the last IWD fight and begin HoW now? If I finish the final IWD battle now, will I have to start again in order to get at the new HoW game area's / quests? And when would you recommend I install TotLM? Im so confused!!

My original plan was to complete all of IWD first, and THEN install TotLM and THEN begin HoW - all with the same party. I would prefer to complete IWD first before beginning HoW as it seems a bit unrealistic just leaving a quest 99% complete to begin another, and then going back to finish it a few months later!!

Whaddya think? [img]graemlins/1ponder.gif[/img]

[ 11-10-2003, 02:38 PM: Message edited by: kroma ]

Since youve already been spoilt I will better mention names to prevent confusion, so spoilers below.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
There are 2 ways you can start HoW

1)Any time during the game go to Hjolder and go to HoW... you must do this BEFORE you go to the frozen Easthaven. After you finish the HoW areas you will go back to IWD areas and can finish the game there. The advantage of this method is that you will have much more experience when fighting the last IWD boss.

2)Finish the IWD boss, you will then go to HoW. Finish HoW. Game over. This method has the advantage that you will have one very nice item from frozen Easthaven which you can later upgrade in HoW.

Now as for Totl,
(no more spoilers)
install it now. in HoW in an inn you will find someone who will take you to ToTL areas. Now, once you go there there is no coming back until you finish all ToTL areas.... once you come back you can finish HoW.. And one more thing, you must go to ToTL BEFORE you go to Sea ** ****** *** (you will know when because you will be warned that once you go to Sea ** ****** *** there is no coming back.

I am already in the Frozen Easthaven - does that mean I cant go back to Kuldahar to speak to the Hjolder? If I complete the IWD final battle, am I automatically taken to the beginning of HoW?

I think I will go for this method then... Install TotLM now, THEN finish IWD and THEN being HoW. Does this sound alright?

It sounds just fine, but you wouldn't be transferred automatically to HoW.
Game will export your characters after the final IWD battle and name exports IWDHOW1-IWDHOW6 (original IWD exported characters before the final battle and those exports are named IWD1 to IWD6)
Then start a new game and choose Expansion Only,import your characters and you are ready to start HoW
Don't let anybody die in final battle and use IWDHOW exports or use IWD exports in case of dead characters- they will be alive and they will keep their stuff, minus the exp for IWD boss.
Don't forget to take the items from containers, before you take on the IWD boss, you will lose them, because containers cannot be exported.

Thanks for the info guys!

Think I will try and complete the main game tonight... Seeing as though this thread already contains spoilers, I may as well mention names etc in this post...


* S P O I L E R S *
...................
..................
.................
................
...............
..............
.............
............
...........
..........
.........
........
.......
......
.....
....
...
..
.

Behlifet (sp?) whooped my ass first time I played him, so I better rethink my tactics before trying again. It may well be that I actually have to take on HoW before I am able to defeat him... So because of this, one of my original questions still stands -

"I am already in the Frozen Easthaven - does that mean I cant go back to Kuldahar to speak to the Hjolder?"

Have I left it too late, to the point where now I *MUST* finish IWD before I can begin HoW? (ie - unable to leave Frozen Easthaven until I have killed Behlifet).

???

[ 11-08-2003, 12:52 PM: Message edited by: kroma ]

The answer is yes, you'll have to fight Belhifet before going to HoW.
You cannot go to Kuldahar from frozen Easthaven, only other option is a save before you engaged RBP, i.e. walk back from LDD to Kuldahar and talk to Hjollder. (I think that game autosaves before you climb the stairway to RBP, and the next autosave is when you enter ice temple. I hope you didn't enter it yet, but again my post may already be too late.)

EDIT: spelling

[ 11-08-2003, 03:00 PM: Message edited by: Yanez ]

Excellent, thanks Yanez...

Like I said, I have already fought Behlifet, but lost by a long way!!

Ill just have to find a way of defeating him, and then I can get on with HoW!

[img]graemlins/ninja.gif[/img]

<font color = mediumspringgreen>Hang in there kroma, you can do it!

I got stomped the first few times, too... and that was RBP!! Big B absolutely crushed me the first few tries, also. There is a thread not too long ago (several months old?) wherein some (including moi) listed tactics for beating this guy. I didn't find it; but found another where I was bragging away about the last fight, and gave some tips on how I did it. The thread is entitled: "The End of IWD."

You can have your end game experience both ways: What I did was complete IWD; but then took the same party, from a save just before meeting RBP, and walked them back to Kuldahar to do HoW. So.... they get to meet Big B again (can you say "deja vu?"), but this time my party will have beaten HoW AND TotLM, and will each have about 10 more levels under their belts, and be in possession of some much more powerful equipment. Heh, heh, heh: Can hardly wait for that fight....

What's a party,
without a song?
Bard's ROCK!
Party on!!</font>

kroma,

If it comes down to it (and I hope it doesn't for you), you always have the option of lowering the difficulty to get through this fight. I had to do this my first time, because my party was just too weak. I tried again and again with many strategies and couldn't do it. Lowering the difficulty took some of the joy out of the final fight, but I was at the point where I didn't care, because losing over and over was no fun.

As for a strategy that works, for this fight I find that taking out the two "helpers" first and then focusing all your attention on the big guy works best. I read about and tried to go exlusively for the big guy right off, but couldn't defeat him fast enough to avoid a lethal beating from the other two.

Lymond

Hi Lymond,

Thanks for your reply. I agree with you that after a certain number of attempts at a particular fight, you just want to get on with the game and dont really care how you get past it... I was like that with the Lizard King guy in Dragon's Eye - just couldnt beat him no matter how hard I tried. In the end though, I just left the game alone for a day or so and when I came back I defeated him - and that feeling was great! ;)

So, yeah - I will try my absolute hardest to defeat Behlifet out and out, but I will definately consider lowering the difficulty level if it is my only means of getting on with HoW! (which I am really looking forward to now).

Like I mentioned, I have already taken him on once - he WHOOPED me... I think about 4 of my guys went down before he had even lost any damage whatsoever - however, my plan was to take out the 2 guards first (like you suggested) and I think I managed to knock them down a fair bit.
The other thing was that the party was unrested, slightly down on health, no potions or charms, and down on spells. If I can sort all those problems out, I reckon I stand a good chance with him...

Wish me luck!!

kroma

[ 11-10-2003, 10:44 AM: Message edited by: kroma ]

I havent tried it myself but i think you can (cheese?) it by casting outilukes resilient sphere on the guy standing in very front and while they attack him have the rest take them down with enchanted ranged weapons and spells.

NobleNick,

I totally missed your post, sorry about that... I was only expecting one new reply to this thread so I scrolled down to the very bottom and read Lymond's.

I saw that thread ages ago - but didnt want to open it then (for obvious reasons). I would like to think that I dont need tactics help to defeat him, but I think in reality I will need all the help I can get! Ill check the thread after Ive tried to win the battle myself a few times...

ZFR,

That sounds like a good plan. I use that spell all the time anyway, doubtless it will have some part to play in the final battle.

Cheers guys!

Watch out, spoilers for anyone who haven't engaged IWD boss ahead:
~
~
~
~
~
~
~
~
~
~
~
I don't think that Otiluke's resilient sphere would be the answer here. Iron golems always (at least to my experience) seem to attack spellcasters, and not the party leader. Besides, reslient sphere has two major drawbacks, first is the saving throw, second is a bunch of dispel magic traps, which even a thief with 140% in detect/disarm traps couldn't disarm. So, if i'm thinking right, I would have to cast ORS on my spellcaster/s (not good idea whatsoever :( ) and micromanage the rest of party, so they wouldn't step on those traps.

EDIT: typos

[ 11-10-2003, 02:45 PM: Message edited by: Yanez ]

<font color = mediumspringgreen>kroma,

You have more do-it-yourself resolve than I do!
~
(slight spoiler tactics coming)
~
~
~
~
~
~
~
~
~
~
~

The fact that the IGs like to chase your spell caster can be put to your advantage: Give her the boots of speed and let the IGs chase (just not catch)her! Then pick ONE of the IGs, and hopefully you have about 4 buffed melee guys with +4 weapons to NAIL that sucker as he rumbles by in chase of your wizard. Repeat on second IG after the first goes down. Of course you've got to get Big B's spell timing down, and sychronize your bashing ballet so that he doesn't fry your little congregation.

Study Big B's actions: He's fairly predictable in his timing and his reaction to presence or absence of direct offensive action against his person. If he is the only threat to a given character, there is a window to get a spell off uninterrupted (or close in for a physical assault) if you start as soon as he initiates an Infernal Conveyance (IC) (a Dimension Door-like spell)

Yanez's advice, about micromanaging your player's so that they don't pop the dispell traps, is right on. This fight will take all the tricks you've got, and this is an important one.

Here is another one: Stacking the benefits of (in roughly increasing order of importance) Curse, Bless, Prayer, fire and blunt weapon resistance potions/spells, regenerative/healing potions and spells, Recitation, Improved Invisibility, Haste, and War Chant (as many of these as you've got). Stock up on defensive/buff stuff, because offensive spells are totally worthless on these guys. I saved my Haste until the IGs were both down, since I didn't want it to run out in the middle of meleeing Big B. Remember, the fight starts with a universal dispell, so you can't pre-buff; and you will have to know the exact location of the traps and avoid them to keep any buffs you lay on after the start.

Finally, don't forget the value of summons. No, these guys will not deal out any damage, but they make for excellent speed bumps and traffic detours for the juggernauts that will be chasing your carcass around the floor.

What's a party,
without a song?
Bard's ROCK!
Party on!!</font>

Sorry to bring this one up again guys, I STILL havent taken the big bad guy on, and I do have one more question before doing so...

If I *DO* manage to defeat him, does that mean I wont be able to go back to the chap in the Severed Hand and give him whatever it was he was after? (I cant even remember! Was it the water? Or the bird? Or both? Actually, dont answer that one!).

P.S - I havent read your suggestions yet, NobleNick - but I will do either if I cant get my own tactics to work, or once I have finished the job off on my own!

Am afraid yes, you can no longer go back to the Severed Hand, and though it wont make you feel any better, I'll mention that those items give really lots of XP.

I cant go back to the Severed Hand, even though I havent yet taken on Big B?

Hmm... In that case then I might have to look for a earlier save game. Unfortunately I am a bit of a completist, and I cant stand leaving parts of the game undone - hence me starting this thread in the first place!

Cheers all... [img]smile.gif[/img]

<font color = mediumspringgreen>kroma,

That is correct. Once you encounter RBP and get transported, there is no going back. In addition to not revisiting Severed Hand, you lose the ability to enter HoW with all your goodies saved up in containers (scroll cases, etc.).

Hopefully you have a save from just before you tried to take him on.

What's a party,
without a song?
Bards ROCK!
Party On!!
</font>