Can you all compile your knowlege about this class into this topic for me?. It seems to me that this could be a very powerful class if used correctly and I'd like to learn about it, so it would be much apprieciated if you could all enlighten me on such things as pros, cons, versibility, good weapon/item combinations, tactics and anything else you can think of.

Im doing multi media at school and we get a whole term to make a website that will be marked at the end of it all, Im planning to do mine on the BG series as it interests me and there is heaps to write about it. So there will prolly be quite a few posts from me seeking information about things that a powergamer would never think of learning about (tactics comes to mind...)

cheers,

EDIT: grammer, shocking.
EDIT: before you post i would just like to let everyone know that i might be using what you put donw here in my guide in the exact same words. I cant think of a reason why people would worry about this but i thought i might as well be safe than sorry

[ 03-26-2005, 04:51 PM: Message edited by: lost prophet ]

I'll start the data organization.

Determining your levels.
Kensais get all their special abilities every 3rd and 4th level. I'm not sure about base warrior abilities, as even volothamp can't help me out there. Therefore, it is only logical to dual at level 9 12 15 or 16. 12 gets all the abilities (12 is both a multiple of 3 and 4). 9 sacrifices one of each ability, but allows for a much much much easier reactivation. 15 allows that one extra damage, but 16 goes ahead and gives one more kai and move. My opinion, if you are playing solo, dual at 16. If not, or you are playing SoA only, dual at 12.

Next up, proficiencies. Obviously, you want to make good use of your kai ability, and I have just the thing for that. How about celestial fury, Belm, and bracers of blinding strike. Thats 9 attacks all doing MAX damage. Of course, Crom would probably be better in offhand for its massive strength boost, but you are a sword saint right? and you cant backstab with a hammer. Other notes of interest, firetooth +3 is the best dagger in the game, it hits everyone except a few monsters, and it also does double damage unless you fix it with a mod or something.

Tactics:
stealth is your absolute best friend. I highly reccomend having the cloak on non-detection so you can waste enemy true sights, then go in for the kill. If you are facing difficult opponents, kai before you hit them, then watch them chunk. Dont forget about groups that are not initially hostile. If you hide, hit, and fade, you can take out one opponent, and then run away unscathed.

Other tactics:
throw your dagger, run away, hide in shadows, repeat.

Cheap cheap tricks:
If you ever get blinded, you might think "ugh! time to reload!" I say nay, you blind me, so I get to cheese you til you die a horrible firey or poisonous death. Please note that while blinded, you can't see any monsters, so hide in shadows. Then, set a trap. Instantly, it goes off and kills everyone in the room. If it didnt, hide again and repeat. For this reason, it might be a good idea to blind yourself (level 1 spell blinds for one turn). You can use the wizard eye to see, or a familiar, or another character.

Another creation cheese. By dualing to a thief, you have the unique opportunity to gain exp simply by disarming traps and picking locks. Potions allow you to almost instantaneously become an uber-thief for up to 3 hours. Also, consider leaving quests unfinished, so you regain your exp after you dual, giving the 50000 exp to just your thief side, shooting you up to half the BG exp cap. Then, of course, there is the proficiency cheese. When you gain your proficiencies for a fighter, put them into a grand mastery place, or a place that thieves can't access. Then, when you make your thief side, choose 2 other classes of weapons and then gain exp. Level up as normal, but once you gain an extra prof point, press escape and continue your journey to reactivate your kensai. Then, once you have reactivated it, you will notice the 3 or 4 proficiencies you saved up are placeable like you were a fighter. That way, you don't waste them on weapons you will never use.

If you plan on making a site about bg, PLEASE make it informative with data and such. Don't forget to take a look at sixofspades' excellent spoiler free site. It contains a vast amount of data with a very small load time. (link is in his signature)

Great post!! just what im looking for.

My site will have the usual( character creation, classes balh blah ) but will also discuss more indepth things that i enjoy writing about, such as good kit combinations, powergaming vs roleplaying, the background of the main characters and any other ideas people give me or I come up with.

Yeh i have read Sixes awsome guide and thats what gave me the inspiration to write my own. His was great and is the standard I hope to achieve in my own guide.

Zzzzzzzzzzzzz.

Get to L24 as a Kensai.

* 12 WP (5* Katana, 5* FoA, 2* dual wield)
* -6 Speed Factor to weapons
* Warrior HLA's
* +6 THAC0/Damage Kensai Bonus (EDIT: Whoops, probably +8)

Dual class. Get to L28 as a thief.

* Use any Item...
* Assassination...
* Grand Mastery from the fighter class. Backstabbing with Celestial Fury is rather nice.

Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz.

[ 03-26-2005, 06:34 PM: Message edited by: Dace De'Briago ]

Lol that would be very hard to start a level 1 thief somewhere in "the first city" in ToB would it not?

note: anyone know where i can get the stats for celestial fury?

Katana +3
To enchant a katana is no simple process. Unlike conventional weapons, the katana is already a near-perfect fighting sword. To improve it usually requires a sacrifice, perhaps a dying samurai might beg a Wu Jen to infuse his fighting spirit into the spirit of the katana. The wielder of an enchanted katana, such as this one, must respect the customs of Kara-Tur and of the samurai who once carried this blade into battle. Not doing so could drastically change one's luck for the worse.

STATISTICS:

Equipped Abilities:
Lightning Strike: Once per day
Blindness: Once per day
Combat Abilities:
Booming Thunder whenever the sword strikes an opponent
(Stun, Save vs. Spell)
Shocking Blow chance when sword strikes an opponent
(5% chance of 20 additional electrical damage)
THAC0: +3 bonus
Damage: 1D10 +3
Damage type: slashing
Weight: 3
Speed Factor: 1
Proficiency Type: Katana
Type: 1-handed
Requires: 6 Strength
Not Usable By:
Druid
Cleric
Mage

Download shadowkeeper, google for it. It searches through your own files, and then converts them so you can read em. That way, it will even display mod items like celstial fury +5. If you choose to add item stats to your site, I suggest you make it sort of like mike's rpg center, but a little more informative. Shoot, you can even copy all that, but just make sure you cite it and edit it to be more correct (2d4 is different than 2-8, or at least it SHOULD be, I'm not sure how those types of die work).

2d4 gives exactly 2-8...

Thanks for that Illumina. Right now the guide is about 3 pages long lol, so it will make for very hard reading. Im trying to work out how to make thumbnails and hyperlinks using the "geocities page maker", when i work that out then it'll be put into clickable sections for a more user friendly guide.

I have looked at other peolples guides (sixes, mikes rpg center) and am getting good information from them.

2d4 is the type of calculation being made and 2-8 is the range of possible scores from the calculation. :D

EDIT: hey look at that lol The Magister.

[ 03-27-2005, 12:37 AM: Message edited by: lost prophet ]

http://www.ironworksforum.com/ubb/cg...925;p=1#000012

It refers to the Kensai > Mage, but you'll probably find something useful there.

2d4 gives
1+1, 1+2, 1+3, 1+4
2+1, 2+2, 2+3, 2+4
3+1, 3+2, 3+3, 3+4
4+1, 4+2, 4+3, 4+4

That means you have a 1 in 4 of getting a 5, 3 in 16 of getting a 4 or a 6, 1 in 8 of getting a 3 or a 7, and 1 in 16 of getting a 2 or an 8. Odds are sometimes confusing, but the fact remains that 2d4 is much more informative than 2-8.

@ Lost Prophet (minor spoilers, be careful while reading)

Try and have a separate page with only charts and graphs, without lots of exposition. Also, when you write tactic ideas, make sure you title them. What would be REALLY cool is if you took screenshots and uploaded them, showing exactly what to do. I'm not sure where that would be useful, as most people who play the game know how to backstab or cast web/cloudkill. Don't bother with a quest section, there are other sites that do that just fine, unless you are going to include alternate quests, like stealing the lathander statuette or working for bodhi.

[ 03-27-2005, 02:41 AM: Message edited by: whathuh ]

Whit the "use any item" Ability you can use some great new items that you Could not use before. One of theese is the Amulet of power which gives your character imune to level drain. And you may use armors to your Kensai/Thief.I don't think you can use a armor becouse the kensai class can't use any armor,and i don't think that the Kensai/Thief class can either,but pleas tell me if i am wrong. And longsword is also a greate choise to use Becouse you have a vast choise between all the longswords in the game. There is only one katana that is realy nice and that is celestial fury. But a deadly combination is to use Crom Feyr and celestial fury,Crom feyr sets your strenght to a incredible 25.

Yes mate, use any item will let your Kensai/Thief run around in full plate armour or whatever you want (yeah you can use the Amulet of Power) [img]smile.gif[/img]

Are ou restricting this to soa or including tob. It makes a differnece for the dualling levels i think.

Whathuh: yes I am thinking of writing charts and all the rest but im not to confident about using geocities pagemaker so idont really know how to have links to other pages and stuff but I will get there and then Ill make some. As for screen shots I dont have the third disc right now so i can install it but if you have any shots of subjects you think shoudl be discussed ( or will help the information i already have. feel free to send them to me and ill add them.
Since im not really familiar with the workings of the program the tactics for the classes are under there discription ( in a different colour ) until i can make another page lol.

Aragorn: The guide will encompass Tob as well though not BG1 or its add on. I feel that SoA isnt really complete without ToB so its definalty having a part in my guide.

Thanks Lord Siefer and Dace for clearing that technicality about the K/T it is now mentioned in the classes tactics section.

Ah nice link Dace, Im also looking for info on the K/M as well, ive already found 1 site but it'll be good to look at 2 different points.

Im a bit stupid really as i need to no more than just about the K/T and should have put a more vague thread topic so i can ask more questions. Im not sure what to do since i dont want to spam and start another thread when this one is attracting attention from you all lol. If it is your inclination, please check in here when you feel like it to see if theres anymore questions.

cheers.

oh and if a kensai/thief with UAI put on armor would he lose his kensai bonuses/abilities?

I'd love to help you with your site. Unfortunately, I always hate making in-depth information on games that are like 5 years old. They usually aren't played after I finally figure out how the game works.

You can only lose the ability to stealth and cast spells while wearing certain items. That means, nothing higher than chain mail!

I'll add on a few more tidbits of information on other classes, and I will try to be brief for reading's sake.

Notes on ability scores.
Strength: Important skill for anyone using melee, but with easily boostable items (crom, 4 belts, angurvadal, potion of strength, numerous spells) it is not an incredibly important stat. It affects ALL classes.

Dexterity: The most important skill in my opinion, -4 to dex at 18 is simply a necessity to all powergamers, but feel free to roleplay too. A dex of 6 is EXACTLY THE SAME as a dex of 14, so choose wisely. It affects ALL classes.

Constitution: Another important stat, but only extremely important to Warriors. For non-warriors, a 25 con is the same as a 16 con, except that 25 con has a slow regeneration time (1/turn I think. 24=1/2 23=1/3 22=1/4 21=1/5 20=1/6). Also, a 14 con is the same as a 6 con, so choose wisely. For warriors, 19, 21 and 24 are the desired breakpoints for +5,6 and 7 hp/level. It affects all classes up to 16, and fighters up to 25. All classes get the regen (again is negligable due to rings of regeneration etc...)

Intellegence: Severely idiotic stat. TOB nullifies the requirement of having 19 int, as 18 int allows everything one could ask for, and you can delete spells you don't want (you can hold up to 18 of them, 19 lets you hold them all). 18 int is apparantly required to cast level 9 spells, but I dont think that is true. Please correct me someone who has a high level mage w/o 18 int. % to learn spell is nullified by lowering difficulty or drinking multiple potions of genius, and scribing all your scrolls. Lore bonus is just balogna. Only MAGES benefit from Int, all classes recieve the lore bonus. Yes, sorcerers only gain lore from int.

Wisdom: Much like Intellegence, wisdom is specifically designed towards clerics and druids. High wisdom results in more bonus spells of mainly low level spells (18+ starts giving bonus 4th spells, which are more useful. Thus, a low wisdom is even viable for a priest. Wish and limited wish are affected by wisdom, so drinking a potion of insight to raise your wisdom of 3 can give you access to ALL the wish options. Wisdom affects priests, but the wish spell also affects mages. All classes get the lore bonus.

Charisma: Laugable ability. with the level 1 spell friends and ring of human influence, you can change your 3 charisma into 25. There are various charisma based encounters, and only matter to the leader of the group, thus making only one person with a high cha necessary. Affects all classes, but is by far the most useless ability.


Theres my interpretation of the stats, feel free to copy that.

I dont expect many people to be reading this except for maybe a few on IW.Im doing it because it will be a fun project and I will learn a lot of new information about the game from you all.

As for the fact that hardly anyone plays them I can see your point, but dont forget we are currently posting on a forum with thousands of members who play this game and might like to have a look at some of it.

keep up the good work and cheers for the info.

prophet,