Heyas everyone


I have seen this 'TuTu' abbreviation all over but have no idea what it is or what it stands for. If anyone could be so kind as to enlighten me I would be ever so grateful.

Thanks alot

--Kestrel--

It's a mod, not sure myself, but i THINK it converts bg1 into the bg2 engine, so does BGT. But it could just add kits etc, so you should ask some of the wiser people than myself.

Thank's for the introduction..


Basicaly it just means you can play BG1 in the BG2 engine, you've got to have both games installed for it to work..

BGT is a bit diffrent in aim, but the effect is pretty much the same..


The main diffrences are easy of installation, BGT can be a bit tricky at times, while Tutu's not so bad.. But that's just me..

So, are the graphics the same as BGII or like BGI still? Does it use the 2nd Edition rules as in BGII and have the races, like Half-Orc and the new classes and things? Sorry if I sound alittle dim, im just trying to understand what it is exactly and whether or not to get it

Thanks alot
--Kestrel--

BGTutu -

Total Conversion mad which makes BG2 into BG1. That means you get the BG1 storyline, NPCs, etc.
AND the BG2 graphics, ruleset, kits, engine,...

BGT -
Mod that adds BG1+TotSC to (before) BG2. That means you get BG1+TotSC+BG2+ToB storyline (connected by a transition cutscene from BG1 to BG2) all in the BG2 graphics, ruleset, kits, engine,...

So basically BGT would allow you to play the whole trilogy as a Kensai for example without saving once (heed the bugs ;) ).
With BGTutu you could play BG1 as a Kensai, save you char, uninstall the mod, load your char and continue through standard BG2+ToB.

However BGTutu is a much smaller download and a lot easier to install.
Both mods require you to have all of the trilogies CDs (BG1+TotSC+BG2+ToB).

So, if I were to install TuTu, which seems the better choice, in order to play BGII and ToB I would have to uninstall TuTu again? Or could I play with it installed. Would it mess up my BGII games now if I were to install it? Sorry, im being a pain.

--Kestrel--

Tutu is the better choice. [img]smile.gif[/img]

If you want to play BGII too, your choices are:

1. Play Tutu, export your PC at the end then run the BGII-restore program that comes with Tutu.
2. Make a second installation of the game and keep one as BGII.

Your BGII saves won't change but I'd recommend starting a new character from level 1 for Tutu. [img]smile.gif[/img]

Oh, and an URL since nobody has posted one:

http://www.pocketplane.net/tutu

Be sure to get the FixPack too. [img]smile.gif[/img]

For Tutu mods, check out pocketplane and http://www.gibberlings3.net too.

Wait a minute--what's this about uninstalling? It was my understanding (watch me shoot my mouth off about something I know next to nothing about) BGTuTu stood for BGTutorial, meaning that you could load up SoA, and choose "New Game" if you wanted to wake up in Irenicus's dungeon.....or you could choose "Tutorial" if you wanted to start in Candlekeep, and you would continue through BG1 & ToSC until you beat the game, at which time the BG2 movie would play, and you would wake up in Irenicus's dungeon.

To me, this more sense, not to mention being a heck of a lot more convenient, than uninstalling or having separate copies of BG2. If it isn't done this way, why isn't it?

nope - tutu replaces the BG2 content with the BG1 content

Start New Game and there you are in candlekeep

You have to run the 'Restore' (~uninstall) before you can play BG2 again - it works ok though

hihi *i get to lecture Six, i get to lecture Six* [img]tongue.gif[/img]

BGtutu is a very small prog (it was less than 1MB in the early stages IIRC) that converts BG2 into BG1
BGT is the BIG mod that replaces the TutorialButton with Baldur's Gate 1 and thus is a lot more convenient (especially if you have parallel games running) and also brings more continuity into the trilogy. Also it allows you to take your BG1 NPCs into BG2 (although this has always been kinda buggy, e.g. when Xzar meets Xzar ;) )
and adds some new items (including a lesser bag of holding, a certain overpowered cloak and an overpowered helmet that can be taken to BG2). This is paid for by a much larger size (about a CD in the last distribution 1GB+ in the first :D )

To answer the persistent question above:
If one uses BGTutu
1. there is no possibility (save a second BG2 installation) to play BG2 concurrently
2. you have to export/import your PC to get him/her from BG1 to BG2
3. you cannot take NPCs or items (other than the infamous pantaloons and some other unique goodies) from BG1 to BG2
4. you have to run the uninstall prog for Tutu or make a clean new install to get your BG2 back (unless you have a second BG2 install of course)

[ 12-22-2004, 03:37 PM: Message edited by: Faceman ]

Nope. Try saying BG1Tutu out loud, and the meaning's more evident. [img]smile.gif[/img]

It'd look grossly unprofessional to have the game started via the tutorial button. On top of that, there are a number of technical difficulties to implement it this way, which BGT works around awkwardly. Finally, it was the team's decision that it was better to have two games that stood alone well than hack them together like BGT did and end up with a disjointed story. BGT's handling of the transition is... not amazing, and the plot flaws such as the PC's mother changing roles become all the more apparent when playing both games through at once.

Also as I understand it BGT forces you to play TotSC after you've finished the BG1 storyline, you can't just go there you have to run though all the game to get to it..

Tutu let's you play the TotSC missions when you like pretty much.

BGT also estimates (correct me if I'm wrong) over and hour to install and unpack on an average system..

Tutu generates a transition save when you uninstall as I recall, though I could be wrong and it might just be a diffrent bit..

I've played with Tutu a few times, though I hit a show stopper that killed all my saves so be a wary.

TUTU is the mod that lets you play as BG2 characters (kensai, monk, etc) in BG1, and is accesed in the above method of the tutorial making you play through the begining of BG1. I think.

[ 12-22-2004, 07:19 PM: Message edited by: Sir Degrader ]

...no, Tutu is NOT started via the tutorial. It replaces BG2, so starting a new game places you in Candlekeep. [img]smile.gif[/img]

Maybe some big letter's, dunno the code for making somthing big but it'd be an idea.. Maybe it'd get read then, but then they is only 'uman..


Tutu is a play on the sound of words, say the word To then say the word two..

So basicaly it's BG to BG two, or BGtutu

Get it?

[ 12-22-2004, 07:42 PM: Message edited by: Q'alooaith ]

Its also a type of dress.

Ok, I have installed it all:

BG1TuTu v4
BG1TuTu Fixpack v5
BG1 Patch
BG2 Patch

But whenever I try to advance to a different area, from the Lion's Way to either The Friendly Arm Inn, Larswood or Beregost, when it is loading it exits the game and crashes. Does anyone know how to fix it? If not it doesnt matter, its not imperative I play BG1 again.

Thanks alot

--Kestrel--

Well, after playing my F/M/T through Tutu and getting bored very early in SoA (too powerful) I've just started the game again with a... Anti-Paladin.

*sighs* after 2 days of game time, he is a level 5 fighter. Is this going to be too easy? O_o

tell me, what is an anti-paladin? or is it some silly unofficial class like that generic archer...

The Generic Archer is almost completely balanced. the Anti-Paladin, on the other hand, is....um....rather munchkin-friendly. It's an Evil Fighter, with all the advantages of the Inqisitor kit, the additional ability of Dispel Magic on every melee hit (no matter with what weapon), and no disadvantages whatsoever.

I still think BGT is worth a shot. I know, having spoken with most involved, that even Bardez wanted bgt to be more of a tutu like mod in the sense of teh idea. But I still think the game isn't too bad, bugs have been ironed out, and Mark III is much easier to install than the original. Granted, it may take a little longer to install, but if you want to play a game which will take up days of your time, you may aswell make it as enjoyable as possible. I like the idea of TotSC, since it seems more realistic in my opinion, and you can completely skip it if you want, (although it seems rather pointless to miss out on all the good stuff) the transition isn't that bad, and is much more streamlined and user friendly than tutu to that degree.

and don't forget that BGT will reward you with a helmet that makes Mind Flayers into mindless goblins more or less :D

[ 12-24-2004, 04:51 PM: Message edited by: Faceman ]

And what about those whitout a copy of TotSC? What are we supposed to do? [img]graemlins/verysad.gif[/img]

[ 12-24-2004, 05:49 PM: Message edited by: bjorn ]

Tutu should work regardless of the presence of either TotSC or ToB, although there are some speciall install instructions for non-TotSC users.

anybody that uses items that aren't in BG offically or any patches that allow multiple items to be used past the black isle restrictions (eg using rings of protection should NOT be able to be used with magic armour for a REASON!!) are NEWBIEEEEEEESSSSS!!!!!!!!!!

it is cheating! if u've used either of these and pass it on Insane to me that is worth less than somebody who has passed it on easy....

oh, come on
it's a fun helmet :D

What makes Black Isle's design decisions so perfect?

[ 12-25-2004, 06:30 AM: Message edited by: SimDing0 ]

Sorry i was a bit with my way just then [img]tongue.gif[/img] i'm sorry [img]smile.gif[/img] merry xmas too!!

But they made the game like that for the reason of making it balanced and to avoid some classes vastly overpowering others.

Eg) the restriction which stops a fighter from using magic protection armour and rings means that his armour class (which is already way lower than a mages) cannot be lowered twice whilst a mage who cannot where armour at all only has the option of being lowered once either way.

Another arguement against the "ease of use" patch is that black isle designed the game to have enemies which would suit opponents with a particular AC. Bending the game to lower this intended AC means you are no doubt making the game easier for yourself.
The same goes for non-official items. Seriously, how many of these items are actually less good than others found in the game? not very many.

I didn't mean to rant, but in a game where the items that you find are an even greater source of power than your character's build means that bending the restrictions that black isle put on the game by wearing items in a way which stops the restrictions or by using the weapons the game permits i feel that a person loses all bragging rights when these are broken [img]tongue.gif[/img]

lol bye

Heheh, merry christmas to you too. I do agree that things like Ease of Use's component to allow wearing of multiple magical items is rather unbalancing, and yes, it'd make beating any given battle distinctly easier.
On the other hand, I think that these days, the majority of mods are leaning towards introducing more balanced items, so I wouldn't encourage instinctive rejection of mod items as "cheating". Modding's generally past the stage where something like TDD comes along with a +12 weapon and a quest to kill some gods. [img]smile.gif[/img]

There even were tries to make balanced +10 weapons, honestly.
Somebody posted something about a "Hackmaster +10" some time ago. It was a killer weapon, but had a 10% chance of vorpal hit on self :D so it would be a last resort.
Said helmet of course is a bit too powerful and probably was made out of annoyance of mind flayer battles, but BGT in general adds almost no new items and the few it does may be powerful but do in no way compare to SotM or the Cloak of cheese ;)

a +10 weapon balanced?? lol!

what is SotM and cloak of the cheese? hehehe

It actually was a <a href=http://www.ironworksforum.com/ubb/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=2;t=022623>Hackmast er +12</a>
and although it was meant as a fun item (like the Butterknife of Balduran) we had a lively discussion about how to balance it out.

SotM - Staff of the Magi
Cloak of Cheese - Cloak of Mirroring
Both are standard issue Black Isle items and both invite a whole lot of cheese to the party [img]smile.gif[/img]

<font color=plum>I disagree that being able to add Rings of Protection to armor unbalances the game. To me, it actually conforms the game to the original PnP rules.

I played PnP by 1st Edition rules. Some of our DM's were more strict than others, but the one that taught me the game was probably the most "balanced" as far as the items he allowed players to have.

The standard rule for AC bonus was that each different item would add their bonus to your AC. In other words, you got the benefit from armor, Ring of Protection, Cloak of Protection and Boots of Speed - but did NOT get the bonus from two Rings of Protection.

As for the argument that this "unbalances" the original "Black Isle" rules - poppycock. When I first joined IW, I saw plenty of posts with players bragging about having an AC of -12 to -15, and this was BEFORE "Ease of Use" or any other Weimer Mod came along. They were getting those AC's with the plain vanilla version of BG2 and the standard items found in the original game. How they did it is beyond me, because I've NEVER had an AC better than -10 (which was also the max AC available in PnP rules - regardless of how many different items you may have had).

As for items found outside the game, some are powerful. But the game itself has some items that are JUST as powerful, so that argument kinda falls flat too.

As for the whole discussion of BGTuTu vs BGT, it sounds to me like the best option is just to play <font color=ivory>BG1 Vanilla</font>. The character classes are strong enough and you avoid ANY transition or concurrent game problems. Yeah, it would be nice to play a barbarian or beserker in BG1, but a straight fighter will serve just as well until you advance to BG2.

Personally, I'm glad to see this thread. I had recently considered installing BGTuTu (just to give it a try), but the discussion here has convinced me to just leave my BG1 game alone.</font>

Don't give up on Tutu or BGT yet Cerek. It's not about powergaming it's about having better graphics ;) and about the possibility to toy around with the kits and new classes on lower levels. In case of BGT it also gives you the freedom to take some brand new (actually old) NPCs to BG2.

<font color=plum>I understand that, <font color=white>Faceman</font>. And I would dearly love to have Dynaheir in BG2. But if TuTu or BGT is going to cause problems with my BG2 game, then it simply isn't worth it to me.

I have too many Mods installed and too many different games going to do a second installation of the game just to accommodate being allowed to have kits in BG1.</font>

Isn't using dead NPC's against the whole honourable roleplayer way?

And Cerek. I believe that if Black Isle had made BG with the rules you state then the armour and rings would be different or the enemies and battles you encounter would be different to suit the change.

It is all about full circle balance. Take a link out of this full circle balance and then imbalance flies everywhere and we get people gloating about how great they solo when they don't even follow the rules of the game...

Dynaheir sadly is among the NPCs you can't use. Every member of the "standard party" (i.e. Minsc, Dynaheir, Imoen, Jaheira, Khalid) you lose after the transition. While you can get the classic three back Dynaheir and Khalid are gone forever.
Other NPCs (like Xan, Shar-Teel, Kivan,...) however you can (or at least could in my version) bring in.

^^

yup that sounds A. O.K. with me :D

<font color=plum>Having the storyline changed so that they weren't killed would avoid that problem - but would create others. Specifically, Aerie is used as a "replacement witch" for Minsc and the romance with Jaheira could never exist if Khalid wasn't killed.

I only mentioned Dynaheir because I felt she was a MUCH better mage than Edwin in BG1.

I liked Kivan fairly well, though his stats were kinda sucky. I would also like to see Ajantis, Yeslick and the female cleric (that you have to "rescue") available. I never cared for Monteran and his partner to begin with. Xan has a cool sword, but he is terribly wimpy otherwise. Garrick would be a nice addition and he already shows up in BG2 - just not as a joinable NPC.

As for the rings and armor, there is NOTHING "dishonorable" OR "unbalancing" about the changes made by Ease-Of-Use. Like I said, I saw PLENTY of members here bragging about having an AC of -15 or better looooong before Ease-Of-Use ever came along - so there were plenty of ways to abuse the original BG2 system if one put thier mind to it.

Even with Ease-Of-Use, I've never had an AC better than -10 (which was the max allowed in PnP), so I see nothing dishonourable or unbalanced about it.</font>