How do you deal with her?
Does she have any good use in the party or is she just an below average sidekick required by the storyline?
I usually take her with my party but last time i figured that she was just way too bad for an thief character (to fill in the hole if i kick Jan), and also an far worse mage that he is.
So, have you found any way to make her more useful for the party?

Now i´m not talking about saving quests so she can gain experience after leaving underdark; underdark is a part of the game, which i think i need some experience to complete...

So, do you have any thought abouts her usefulness or other such things?


PS: I can always justify leaving Imoen to collect dust into copper coronet with my main character being an chaotic neutral lunatic jester who is currently far more concerned about Viconia than Imoen... ;D

Hmm. Do you have ToB? If you do Imoen can be very powerful Mage altough I prefer Sorcerers. [img]tongue.gif[/img] She can be a good thief all you need is potions.-Plenty of them. :D Jan on the other hand is also very good. Again if you have ToB becuase of certain ToB HLA. Aerie is considerd as the best NPC when it comes to spellcasting.-With ToB that is.
So IMHO Imoen is worth it no doubt. All NPC`s are. Well except maybe for Anomen. :D

[ 09-04-2003, 02:36 PM: Message edited by: Xen ]

Throne of Bhaal that is...
Well i´m getting it pretty soon i think, as well as an extra copy of BG2...
*sigh*
So quickly Throne of Bhaal was drawn from the stores...
No copies of the thing left in online stores; must buy with the original game...
*sigh*

With HLA i assume you mean High Level Abilities?
Yes, i´m looking forward to those...


Spoiler?
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Heh, anomen...
Ghehheh, that sad-arrogant-child-killer!
I led him to take revenge but the poor bastard decided to go child killing...
Ghehheh...
In result, failing his promotion to knight...
Mwahahahaa...
I never liked him...
Uhh, well he ended up as [Gory combat animation] in front of the door of the "most noble order of the radiated heart" or something... [img]tongue.gif[/img]

[ 09-04-2003, 02:51 PM: Message edited by: Legos ]

Bravo! You did a great job by killing Anomen. Altough he is a better Cleric then Viconia.

Yes by HLA I mean High Level Ability. [img]tongue.gif[/img]

If you have SoA only all NPCs max out at about 2.75mio XP IIRC
Therefore pure (Edwin) and dual mages (Nalia,Imoen) excel over multi-class (Aerie,Jan) because they can learn higher spell lvls. Imoen is a quite useful character as
1.) she has about all the basic thief abilities you crucially need (detecting traps and lockpicking) and you can of course imporve that with potions
2.) she makes an excellent mage but can also use some mage-forbidden equipment (e.g. Bows, Swords).
3.) She excels over Nalia because she has a better thief portion and better looks :D

The reason Imoen is often considered weak is that once you rescue her your party is often higher in level than she is. Therefore she tends to be "the one with the low experience". But try a game with lots of party reforming you'll find that some other characters suffer the exact same setback at some point.

Yes, i guess it is the experience difference causing a major piece of the trouble...
But...
I still think she has an disadvantage to Jan since she can´t advance at all with her thief class (I THINK...), and her trap disarming skill is somewhat worse, leaving her at the risk of triggering the trap while disarming it. :/
And Jan can also use swords etc.

And Nalia...
Ugh! She actually managed to remind me of my aunt... Pretty disturbing that is...
And i can´t tolerate the type of a naive character they´ve made her to be...


Aerie? The best spell caster? Did someone say that? Yes? No? Should not write long messages; you forget what others have said before you have finished... [img]tongue.gif[/img]
Well she´s such an whiny...
And she does certainly not suit my main character... [img]tongue.gif[/img]
And jaheira i dumped when she was demanding me to come to the harper hold...
Bah, let the "cross-bred mongrel" -Viconia go harp with the harpies...


Maybe anomen is a better cleric than viconia, and probably a better warrior as well, but he is at least thrice as annoying... [img]tongue.gif[/img]
"The best leaders always follow" or what ever he says...
Besides, an self respecting jester with a weakness to pretty women would never even consider having an arrogant & ugly male instead of an pretty drow... :D
(Well, that´s pretty much the kind of a character i last completed the game with...)

[ 09-04-2003, 03:19 PM: Message edited by: Legos ]

most of the time I take Imone alone regardlessly as I roleplay (my PC is usually good or netural)...low XP or not, she as a thief is servicible for the game and she as a mage is good enough to contribute...and our party can do just fine with or without her anyway...I of course will take my sis along^_*

I would consider twice before taking my sis along with my travels...
Hehehehehe...

That's what most people say - "I let her tag along, what do I care".
I LIKE her and like to use her abilities because Imoen can be a GREAT NPC with the right equipment and if you manage to fill the XP gap. And if you take her along to ToB it gets even more interesting. There are others I find far more useless (Nalia anyone?) and once you get her to these high levels she is unsurpassed in arcane skill by any other NPC (except for Edwin, but he can't even "Identify" [img]tongue.gif[/img] )

[img]tongue.gif[/img] Xen, you seem to contradict yourself quite often.

Quote:

So IMHO Imoen is worth it no doubt. All NPC`s are. Well except maybe for Anomen. You did a great job by killing Anomen. Altough he is a better Cleric then Viconia.

[img]tongue.gif[/img] These statements don't really work together.

Anomen isn't really such a useless NPC.

<font color=cadetblue>Hmm, how is Anomen a better Cleric than Viconia? Viconia wasn't dual classed so she has more cleric levels and she also has a much higher WIS + INT to boot. Throw in a belt of giant STR and she's good to go.</font>

I seem to have this vague memory that there was a heated debate about this subject matter before? Anomen vs. Viconia, who's a better "cleric"? don't remember the final verdict though...

That's what most people say - "I let her tag along, what do I care".
I LIKE her and like to use her abilities because Imoen can be a GREAT NPC with the right equipment and if you manage to fill the XP gap. And if you take her along to ToB it gets even more interesting. There are others I find far more useless (Nalia anyone?) and once you get her to these high levels she is unsurpassed in arcane skill by any other NPC (except for Edwin, but he can't even "Identify" [img]tongue.gif[/img] ) </font>[/QUOTE]well...I did and will take Imone into ToB everytime. I always want to have at least 2 mages in my party, most of the time, Imone is the second mage and the thief (before we get her back, either Jan or Nalia takes that position). My main mage never bother to identify, mostly the lvl 1 slots are filled with my favorite lvl 1 offensive spell. my main mage is the main offensive magic force, and Imone is good as the secondary mage (dispel magic/haste/breach etc...and of course also joins the offensive force). My last run through SoA/ToB, Edwin was the main mage with Imone by the side...she really did well, finishing off Yaga Shura and Draconis.

XP gap doesn't really matter that much, Imone can level up to be effective and helpful regardless of when you take her back.

my current party though has different approach to this XP gap issue, with my PC F/M and Aerie level up very, very slowly, when we get Imone back, there isn't really that much XP gap in the mage department. This time I don't really follow my own main mage + second mage route, it's more like a three mages system, none of them is really ahead of each other. right now, my PC and Aerie are lvl 13 as mage and Imone is at lvl 12, and she will soon over-level the other two mages. This is the first time I play this roster, and so maybe Imone will turn out to be my main mage?

The final verdict is that Anomen is a vastly better NPC than Viconia in terms of party usefulness. Ignorance is what usually gives Viconic the "advantage".

It's that "good" versus "evil" undead turning debate too.
pro good: utterly destroys 'em, fast way to get rid of 20 ghouls
pro evil: controls 'em, control 20 ghouls to get rid of 1 Greater Mummy
contra good: only kills easy undead no help against tough ones
contra evil: once you used your easily turned undead to kill the tougher ones you have to slay all your 20 ghouls manually one-by-one

One by one? njaww, just send em in a corner and fireball em...
Shouldn´t be so tough... [img]tongue.gif[/img]


Asking for spoilers...
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So are there any specific items found working well on her?

I have found that with Stone skin + Short sword +3 backstab (or something such) in one hand + cutthroat +4 short sword in the other hand, Jan can become a nice half tank.

Legos...you know...you talk like Edwin...(I should just fireball all of them when they sleep...) [img]graemlins/laugh2.gif[/img]

well...I'd consider this only if Mazzy isn't in the party. If you don't go to WK early (with ToB installed) to get certain GREAT short sowrd, these two are the best short swords in SoA and Mazzy is among the deadliest fighters in the game dual wielding them (there are other decent daggers and short swords for Jan to sneaks into the battle and backstabs...)

[ 09-04-2003, 11:20 PM: Message edited by: teardropmina ]

To be honest, Imoen has been in just about any party I have made (except the all evil that I am playing off and on). I don't use backstabbing and traps too much, so she handles the two areas that require a thief (locks and traps). If you Baldurdash your game, it gives her extra thief points, making her much more useful (100% in open locks, 95% in find traps). Combine that with the fact that she advances at the same rate as a single class in mage, and she is very useful. I usually go very early to get her back (first opportunity), so she does not lag too far behind.

My first game, I put Imoen, Nalia, and Aerie in the same party. All were good in their specific areas. Imoen was the party thief, who also was #2 in the mage department. Aerie was backup cleric, and also backed up mage quite nicely. Nalia was a straight mage in my party; I did not once use her thieving skills (except for weapons, of course). Heavy on magic, to be sure, but still very good.

I guess it all comes down to your preference. I have always seen her as a strong member of the party, but others may disagree.

One last point on the Anomen vs. Viconia comparison: Don't assume that just because Anomen is Dual-classed and Viconia is a true Cleric, she has a "head-start" on him as far as Cleric levels are concerned--she doesn't.

My current project is a Chaotic party:
CN Wild Mage
Haer'Dalis
Jan
Valygar
Korgan
Anomen

After emerging from the Dungeon, I grabbed Korgan, Jan, Viconia, Valygar, and Haer'Dalis (as quickly as possible). Not counting our Travel Time to & from the Umar Hills, Viconia was in my party for about as long as it took to kill Mekrath and recruit Haer. At this point, I realized that "I can make Viconia (hrmph hrumph) in ToB, but I can make Anomen (hrmph hrumph) a whole lot sooner." So off we went to trade Viconia for Anomen. When I dropped Viconia, she was Level 9 or 10. Anomen, however, was already Level 11, and could cast 6th-Level spells. Do you have any idea how much help a single Aerial Servant can be in the Planar Prison (which is especially important if Haer'Dalis is included in your Party Plans)?

Ehh...
Well at first i got chaotic evil in the one alignment test that has been popping up here and there...
We´re like aligned...
[img]tongue.gif[/img]

Yes, well i have found that the game includes far too many great weapons...

I have some times trained Mazzy with the halberd to get some use out of the nice +4 wave that i usually get...

Minsc has the Vorpal sword...
yeesh, i love that weapon, it was really funny to see one Lich i was attacking die of the first blow that Minsc took at him...
I had prepared with all kinds of spell buffs, and the lich went and died before the fight began. xD

Also, having the equalizer as the off hand sword and Black Razor/Day star as the right hand weapon on my main character...

Uhh, and still it is hard to find use for all of the great wepons found all around...

Er... 2 things.

Undead are immuned to Death Effects for obvious reasons.

Unless you are talking about ToB, or that really, REALLY short end-period of SoA, Blackrazor is kinda limited in its' usage.

Are you saying that the lich should have been immune to the instant kill? O_o
Weird...
Well then i´ll just assume minsc cut his head off...


And Black Razor...
Yes, it is true that in the ending scenes i wont have so many enemies to slash with it, but hey, it makes it no less a fact that the game has a huge load of nice swords and other stuff... :D

did you see the rising ghost animation when Minsc killed the lich?

well, as long as you have ToB installed, you'll have more use of blackrazor...and for tons other useful, powerful weapons...you can always sell them...like certain among the most powerful weapons (some regard as the best), when my party has no character can use that weapon, I just sell it for tons of gold.

[ 09-05-2003, 08:00 AM: Message edited by: teardropmina ]

Yes i did...
I did see the ghost animation...
Well my B-Gate 2 has had other weird problems too...
Like when playing as a dwarf i a few times saw that when the dwarf attacked, his helmet did not follow the animation, but was left floating in the air...


And money is no problem...
Amounts such as 170000 are pretty easy to achieve with my playing style before leaving Underdark...
Actually, pretty much the only things i need money for are the magical items that need to be put together...
The rest i can usually steal... [img]tongue.gif[/img]

Vorpal hits are classified as a Death-Based Attack in the game engine. Liches are naturally immuned to Death Effects since they are Undead, so yeah, you got a bug.

And yet the Mace of Disruption one-hit kills them... [img]smile.gif[/img] Oh, and the cap, IIRC, is something like 3 million experience in vanilla SoA.

That will be because the Mace of Disruption uses a different type of attack.

On a side note, the SoA XP Cap is 2,950,000 XP.

you cant kill whats already dead ;) [img]tongue.gif[/img]

I have always used Imoen and Nalia as my thieves, in fact, I never event tried Jan, and they have always been able to disarm all trap. They never failed even once.

I always have my PC be a thief :D :D

Then i´ll just consider myself unlucky for having seen Imoen trigger traps while disarming them...