i like the balduran set nice armor good sword and nice shield that deflects beholder rays=) the sword is a long sword by the way and im wondering wich of the evil npcs can best use the balduran set im playing an evil party.

would like an answer....

<font color=white> Korgan as tank should fit in the Balduran Armor, added up with the Shield, Sword & Helmet of Balduran... would give yourself a Balduran Wannabe :D ... the Balduran Armor is pretty good (rather expensive though).

What party do you have (evil okay.. but all the evil NPCS included?)

[add] Don't forget the Cloak of Balduran... ;) (Erm.. install tactics :D )

[add2] None of the Evil NPCS are trained in the use of longswords with shields IIRC... maybe your Prot. is a longsword shielded hippy... I don't know [img]smile.gif[/img] </font>

[ 03-19-2003, 02:43 PM: Message edited by: Annatar ]

I didn't reply, simply because I think the set is junk. I guess if Balduran is your hero, you could, but you are probably better off generating your own character. I have no idea how he became legendary if that was all the better stuff he had. The lore is good, I guess (that is the sword, right?) but giving a characters who can wear platemail a 10 point bonus means they are not as good as a bare-nekkid mage. The shield is fine, though it makes defeating the beholderkin trivial, even if you have improved beholders, as long as you leave the rest of the party way behind, and go on a killing spree all on your lonesome.

[EDIT]
Really? I thought I had played nearly all the Tactics mods now, but I must have missed it... Or is it towards the end of the game?
[/EDIT]

[ 03-19-2003, 03:37 PM: Message edited by: Thorfinn ]

<font color=white> IIRC... With Tactics Installed (WeiDU) *<font color="#3D2F1B">There's a She-Lich (Not Mr.Kangaxx) located in the Docks District that drops this particular cloak as loot.</font>*</font>

Oh. Tried that one once with a fairly low level group, didn't quite beat it, though we should have(she died just before my protagonist did), and decided to come back later, rather than do a reload to see if the random factors aligned this time...

[ 03-19-2003, 04:13 PM: Message edited by: Thorfinn ]

I remember seeing the Cloak of Balduran but I forget where...Anyone?

IIRC, the Cloak of Balduran can be found in the Gebhard Blucher's "Lich in the Docks" (Tactics Mod).

(wonders if Thorfinn's Jansen Spectroscopes are calibrated correctly)

Sure, the Plate and the Sword are largely worthless. The Plate's +4 to hitpoints and trivial CHA boost don't come anywhere near justifying the huge cost. The Sword is the only way a low-level Wizard Slayer can get a decent MR, and is helpful when Identifying stuff (it gives +10 to Lore, not +10%), but it's still only +2 enchanted, and also not worth the money.

The Shield is problematic--sure, it's powerful, but so obscenely powerful that most people refuse to use it. Also, there's the fact that it has no logical connection with Balduran whatsoever! Balduran was a sea captain (a Dwarf, I think) and immensely successful merchant and possibly a bit of a pirate as well. What the hell would he want with an Anti-Beholder item as his personal Shield? If *I* was in charge, I'd slap the "reflects Beholder rays" onto some other piece of protective gear, and make the Shield of Balduran into something a seafaring Fighter would actually want.

Junk? Junk, you say? And how exactly do you plan to argue that the Helm of Balduran is not the best damn helmet in the game, all the way through Throne of Bhaal? Sure, it doesn't cast Simulacrum, and it doesn't give Elemental Resistances....but -1 to THAC0, AC, and Saving Throws is pretty dang nifty. And the Cloak is nothing to sniff at either: Most people value the Cloak of the Sewers just for the -1 AC bonus, which stacks with magical Rings or Armor. How do you think they'd like the -1 to Saving Throws and +25% MR? Hmmmm?

I also happen to be designing Boots of Balduran and a Belt of Balduran. Collect the whole set and be swarmed by admiring groupies as you promenade through the Government District!

Now that's funny!

If not for the fact that the Helm is free and available right out of the gate, I probably wouldn't bother. The Resist Damage from the Dragon Helm, Helm of the Rock or Helm of Defense (?) is usually better. One point better save vs magical fire is nice, but 20% damage reduction will help out a whole lot more.

AC 0 armor is available fairly early, at least with Tactics, though I'm pretty sure it is there even in the base game, and 4 more HP is not going to make or break you. Neither will +1 Charisma, considering that you are going to be forced into taking a Ring of Human Influence, and you are going to pull the Nymph Cloak out of your backpack whenever you go into shops.

Cloak of Balduran I already admitted I did not know was in the game, and isn't, unless you count mods. 25% MR is sweet, indeed, assuming you can remember to remove it when you want to buff.

Sword of Balduran is just a regular +2 sword except for the lore and the MR. MR, again, is nice, as long as you remember to remove it before trying to buff. Lore is nice, I guess, and I used to swear by bards, until I played a game without. After splurging on the Glasses of Idenfication, we were carrying around a small handful of unidentified stuff through the midgame, but by the time we were wandering through Underdark, we were sitting on over 20 Identify scrolls. I agree that the sword would be useful with, say Imoen or Jan, who are your primary Lore people, but neither of these can use the Plate. Even if you had a fighter with an 18/18 Int/Wis (and presumably, would have 18 exceptional str, 18 Dex and 18 Con, before throwing points into non-class stuff) all you would get through SoA levels is the ability to identify +2 arrows. Passing them to the Mage is just not that difficult.

Shield I do agree is overpowered within its realm, and I thought I said as much. Though I would not equip it unless I was expecting to encounter beholderkin -- the strength loss is too extreme. It reduces your Girdle of Hill Giant Strength (+3/+7) to a flat 18 (+1/+2), and 18 Exceptionals (up to +3/+6) to a 17 (+1/+1). Thank God you are wearing the Helm of Balduran to offset that loss a little bit, but if you are a fighter (and who can use a sword and wear plate mail and helm but a fighter type?), and have at least specialized in long sword (who wouldn't, if he planned to use Balduran's Gear) he is throwing away up to 10 points of damage per round (20 with criticals), and 1 to hit, the Helm having offset part of the shield's penalty.

Now if you are adding more niceties like the Gauntlets of Balduran, Balduran's Belt, Balduran's Penny Loafers, Balduran's Tie Tack and whatever else, of course you would be able to make a set that would be worth having. On the other hand, anyone other than a diehard Balduran groupie would probably put the shield away most of the time, and grab the Fortress Shield, or Daystar in that other hand, and would grab something like Adjatha or Ras or Namarra in the primary hand unless actually facing magic-using creatures.

Yes, individually, used at the right time, the components are great. But as your standard equipment setup, you can do much better.

i could be way off on this one, but I thought agic resistence didnt stop buffing spells in BG2 ?

<font color=white> It doesn't stop you from buffing, it will only effect offensive spells IIRC.

[add] if MR does prevent buffing... Solaufein would be worthless (same with Viccy) </font>

[ 03-20-2003, 08:57 AM: Message edited by: Annatar ]

Did they cheese MR in BG2???

I am positive that in PnP AD&D, with MR, you had to take the good with the bad, and beneficial magics had the same chance of failing as baneful. I am postitive that in one game of this genre, and I thought it was BG, and might have even been the Cloak of Balduran, I had to remove some item every time I wanted a healing spell, or it stood a chance of fizzling away. Though IIRC, creatures with innate, racial MR could cast spells upon themselves, and were not protected from spells from others of their species. For instance, according to Vault of the Drow, learning the Drow version of fireball allowed you to blast away, and they got no benefit from MR. Drow clerical spells bypassed MR, but yours did not, since they are a divine boon, and it would be impossible to get the equivalent with your party's cleric.

I do agree that it is easier to handle this way, but I contend that it is just a lesser form of cheese than the Cloak of Cheese or using Balduran's Shield vs. beholderkin.

I guess that explains all the people asking whether one spell or another bypasses MR...

<font color=white>Probaly yes, because I never noticed that a buffing spell fizzels because of the MR of a party member, though some time's with Solaufein I get the text ''Magic Ressistance, spell doesn't apply'' something like that (not the exact words), but then the effects do apply (like Imp. Haste).

Maybe this is a Sola bug... don't know.

I agree with you that in BG the MR did prevent buffing when your MR was high (Cloak of Balduran)... and spells occasionlly fizzeld due to the high MR.

But like I said, I never encounterd it that a buffing spell didn't work on a party member.</font>

[ 03-20-2003, 02:42 PM: Message edited by: Annatar ]

Sounds kind of lame to me, at least it does on the one hand. Magic Resistance should IMHO only be applied when attacked by spells cast by hostile beings. On the other hand; magic resistance IS magic resistance, however you look at it. Using magic on the character with magic resistance, be it it beneficial or harmful, it IS magic after all...

*goes off to ponder on the subject*