I hate to burst your bubble, but I believe the point has been driven again and again already.

This is not a free world, but neither is it a totally tyrannical one. This is ZIROC'S world. You have no right for dissent. You already agreed as much when you clicked on the "I Agree" button during the registeration. You may however, have a different opinion, and venues have already been provided to cater for this.

I also believe that Memnoch has covered the issue of respect in his thread. It is about respecting the decision. Respect for the person is up to you.

This is not a public place. You have no right. You can either follow the rules, and respect the moderators and members, or leave. That's that simple.

As for how someone gain respect here, it is by following the rules and by being nice to moderators and posters.

I refer to you, Memnoch's thread, as linked in my post above. I believe the issue of respect has been covered very much in detail there.

Dundee, I don't believe that, when I clicked a button, I signed away a right to free thought. Some people just prefer to keep their thoughts private. I choose not to on this.

Luvian, this is a public place. Or do we have to enter a password to view it now? It's on the internet and open to all; therefore, it is public. I will respect them when they earn it. Mods earn it by being true to their words of not having any favorites. Members earn it by thinking for themselves. For me, that's how I see it. Or do you order me to see it differently because you don't like that?

Mods: While essentially you are correct I believe it is reasonably basic to earn reference and respect first instead of just assuming it be granted?

Also I find it absoloutly childish the way both Neb and Lord Shield have been treated since they were banned. The avatars and labelling of dissidents, the changes to their profiles, are petty and spiteful.

[ 11-24-2002, 03:17 PM: Message edited by: Kaltia ]

You have freedom of thoughts, but not of speech here.
This is not a public place, you have to register to post. It is not open to all.

Mods don't have favorites. I sure don't.

I must say that I agree to Kaltias tought here.

I always knew that those were the rules here..to keep the peace I guess they are necessary. But to have them worded in this way leaves a bitter aftertaste and may make many of the members here think long and hard about whether it is worth it to be here.

We all have our own rights to be here or not, and mods and Ziroc can push us in a given direction. To hear you (Luvian & Dundee Slaytern) push the rules so mercilessly in our faces is not pleasant. If we do not like it, that is just too bad.

I'd like to think that this is not exactly how Ziroc has envisioned this forum's atmosphere to be like. The mods here may deserve a higher respect quotient, but they are not gods, and should not rule with an ironfist. True, questioning a mod's decision erodes the ability for them to keep order. But we should not be treated as children or as following sheep.

I need to think on this place some more.

Mark

An agreement is a contract. By agreeing to it, you have agreed to follow certain rules. Rules are restrictions. Ergo, while you are free to disagree on hindsight, it does not allow you to break the rules.

Public dissentment and making a difference are two different things. You can either do it the proper way, or the improper way. By the rules that you have agreed to follow, the proper procedure is to communicate privately with either the Moderators, or Ziroc directly.

Am I clearer on the issue now?

Yep, and the qualifications to join sure are rigid, aren't they? "Can you read and click?" And speech is just a vocal thought; if you take away freedom of speech you also remove my freedom of thought.

You may say you don't, but practice is much different than theory.

As for you, Dundee, perfectly clear. And as for an agreement, I do not believe that I agreed to squelch myself and turn the other way when I didn't like something or my friends were being pissed on. Lemme ask you this: do you really think they'd take a privately messaged concern into consideration when doing something? No. Nor will they take a public one. However, there is hope in the people, the members. If enough of them are angered, then a true difference can be made. The power is in the proletarians.

[ 11-24-2002, 03:29 PM: Message edited by: SSJ4Sephiroth ]