Yes, yes, just sarcasm! I'm sorry, I forgot we had pro-terrorist people here. I assumed you folks would realize I was kidding about them being allowed to attack us. And, NO, I'm not calling the people that responded to my message pro-terrorist! Geez, I keep digging myself deeper here. So Nachtrafe, 250, & John d Harris, I'm on YOUR side!

Nobody on this board is pro-terrorist. Please engage brain before typing.

As far as I'm concerned, there are no 'sides', just a collection of people debating an issue, some of whom do not agree with others.

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Most Ecstatic and Exotic Mistress of the Illuminati

I too am on your side Astaldo, although probably not as vehemently as the above http://www.ironworksforum.com/ubb/no...iles/smile.gif

The pro-terrorist thing is a bit harsh for the anti-war debaters. It does at times seem like they are supporting the terrorists by making claims that "we brought this upon ourselves" and "let's look at our history before condemning the terrorists". These are irritating posts, but nonetheless true. They are not in support of the terrorist actions, you would need to be a madman to support those murderers, but they are in support of a change in how the western world acts, reacts & thinks, especially in regard to 'lesser' countries. It is unfortunate that we have to use the word 'terrorists' to anger someone so that they respond to our post, usually in a less then resaonable light (much like how sarcasm will get you a response, where straight forward facts will not get you any).

Hiya SC...please refrain from the personal attacks on posters, remember attack the post, not the poster http://www.ironworksforum.com/ubb/no...iles/smile.gif
Thanks for the article btw, will respond to it by email later!



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Never try to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and it annoys the pig
I've got to admit it's getting better, it's getting better all the time
Bossman of Better Funny Stuff.....of the Laughing Hyenas!

Astaldo!! http://www.ironworksforum.com/ubb/no...les/mad111.gif

You need to read more posts before laying down the sarcasm as you are WRONG. This board tolerates a lot of views, but pro-terrorism is NOT one of them. People who want to look at the long-term causal reasons behind what motivated this attack are NOT pro-terrorist. Is this clear??

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Hmmm ... actually, I had the strangest dream last night, and woke up this morning beating my chest and shouting a war cry. I now feel that we should just nuke the bastards.

J/K of course http://www.ironworksforum.com/ubb/no...miles/wink.gif

Thanks for the clarification, Memnoch. I appreciate very much the even handedness displayed by you and the other mods on this forum. Keep up the good work http://www.ironworksforum.com/ubb/no...iles/smile.gif

PS -- will respond to your other email shortly.

America does not protect palestine. America has supplied israel with weapons and allowed them to carry out ethnic cleansing, massacares of refugees and illegal occupation of land. Even the leader of israel Ariel sharon, is a war criminal. The american goverment has always supported israel and has always given bias in the peaces process to them and offered unrealistic terms, Even today the israelis deny the state of palestine exists. This support of israel is the cause of almost all problems in the middle east today. It is also plainly obvious to all that the isreali settle ments are ever edgeing forward on illegaly occupied land

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In nomine Imperatis, guard our armour and our gaze; lubricate our projectile weapons that they do not jam. Bless and brighten the beams of our lasers; fiat lux in tenebris.
He is the Master of Mankind by the will of the gods and master of a million worlds by the might of his inexhaustible armies. He is a rotting carcass writhing invisibly with power from the Dark Age of Technology. He is the Carrion Lord of the Imperium to whom a thousand souls are sacrificed every day.



[This message has been edited by Dramnek_Ulk (edited 10-11-2001).]

You're a very cruel man, Here I thunked you had seen the Light http://www.ironworksforum.com/ubb/no...es/biggrin.gif

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Crustiest of the OLD COOTS
Airline ticket to Afghanistan $800
High powered rifle with scope $1000
Hotel room with roof access $100
A clean Head shot on that sack of Horse Manure Usuma Bin Laden PRICELESS!

[This message has been edited by John D Harris (edited 10-11-2001).]

I've heard, somewhere and read it a few places too, that the jews actually BOUGHT quite a bit of the land they now occupy from the palestinians, it was useless land back then and the palestinians were quite happy to get it off their hands in exchange for cash, then when the jews had made the land fertile, irrigated it and such, the palestinians suddenly started taking an interest in getting their land back, can anyone confirm this? I'm not sure that it's true, but I've heard it from reliable sources.

Moridin, I think some people are going overboard on the "no personal attacks" thing. I agree that attacks should not be personal, but comments like the Cheetah made above are hardly that. More like a shorthand figure of speech. If somebody said that exact same thing to me, I would NOT take offense at it.

[quote]Originally posted by Moridin:
[b
In the scheme of things, a request to engage brain before typing is far less offensive than a 'pro-terrorist labelling', Moridin. However, I take your point.

I do not like being lumped into a 'pro-terrorist' category. I do wish people, instead of opting for the old black and white polarity way of thinking would READ our posts, rather than grabbing at the odd sentence here and there and drawing faulty, polarity based conclusions.

I think also it's good to be aware that some posters are not native English speakers. What comes across as tactless or ill said may simply be down to an imperfect command of the language, and not meant quite as it comes across. Just a thought....

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Most Ecstatic and Exotic Mistress of the Illuminati

[This message has been edited by Silver Cheetah (edited 10-11-2001).]

Sorry to dash your hopes http://www.ironworksforum.com/ubb/no...miles/wink.gif

Btw, did you see my answer to you on the last page of the now locked Capitalism/Christianity thread? No need to comment on it, but I just want to make sure you see it. I congratulated you on proving me wrong http://www.ironworksforum.com/ubb/no...miles/wink.gif

Ok, for the lowdown on this written by JEWS, go to the URL below...

http://www.cactus48.com/truth.html

To my mind, it's a very clear statement of what happened since the year dot. And it goes into topic you mention in great detail.

Here's the introduction, just to whet anyone's appetite that's interested:

'The standard Zionist position is that they showed up in Palestine in the late 19th century to reclaim their ancestral homeland. Jews bought land and started building up the Jewish community there. They were met with increasingly violent opposition from the Palestinian Arabs, presumably stemming from the Arabs' inherent anti-Semitism. The Zionists were then forced to defend themselves and, in one form or another, this same situation continues up to today.

The problem with this explanation is that it is simply not true, as the documentary evidence in this booklet will show. What really happened was that the Zionist movement, from the beginning, looked forward to a practically complete dispossession of the indigenous Arab population so that Israel could be a wholly Jewish state, or as much as was possible. Land bought by the Jewish National Fund was held in the name of the Jewish people and could never be sold or even leased back to Arabs (a situation which continues to the present).

The Arab community, as it became increasingly aware of the Zionists' intentions, strenuously opposed further Jewish immigration and land buying because it posed a real and imminent danger to the very existence of Arab society in Palestine. Because of this opposition, the entire Zionist project never could have been realized without the military backing of the British. The vast majority of the population of Palestine, by the way, had been Arabic since the seventh century A.D. (Over 1200 years)

In short, Zionism was based on a faulty, colonialist world view that the rights of the indigenous inhabitants didn't matter. The Arabs' opposition to Zionism wasn't based on anti-Semitism but rather on a totally reasonable fear of the dispossession of their people.

One further point: being Jewish ourselves, the position we present here is critical of Zionism but is in no way anti-Semitic. We do not believe that the Jews acted worse than any other group might have acted in their situation. The Zionists (who were a distinct minority of the Jewish people until after WWII) had an understandable desire to establish a place where Jews could be masters of their own fate, given the bleak history of Jewish oppression. Especially as the danger to European Jewry crystalized in the late 1930's and after, the actions of the Zionists were propelled by real desperation.

But so were the actions of the Arabs. The mythic "land without people for a people without land" was already home to 700,000 Palestinians in 1919. This is the root of the problem, as we shall see.'


This is a REALLY good little booklet, in several sections, really easy to read. I really recommend it.

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Most Ecstatic and Exotic Mistress of the Illuminati

Thanks for clearing that up for me SC.

Cheetah, your Israel post above would make the start of a great separate thread. The danger in posting it in this thread is that it will be lost. If you post it in a separate thread, with an appropriate title, it will be more readily available for everyone who is interested in that topic to find http://www.ironworksforum.com/ubb/no...iles/smile.gif

http://www.ironworksforum.com/ubb/no...iles/smile.gif Yeah...I'm one of those vilifier types too. I'm currently trying to apply retardant to all of the bridges that I'm immolated lately. http://www.ironworksforum.com/ubb/no...iles/smile.gif

*Offers Handshake*

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"In Memorium of those who are gone, and all those that bought our freedom with their hearts blood!"

"May the Colors of Liberty never run"
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