Well, while we're talking ToB, I tell you that the BEST thing to do is having a spell trigger with protection from evil, mirror image and protection from magical wepon. THEN, after casting that one, you do a fine little Gate http://www.ironworksforum.com/ubb/no...iles/smile.gif

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We call him Bobby Corwen
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the one problem with a mage in BG2 is the cloak of mirroring and similar items...they are really unfair I have to say. Enemies keep trying to dispel my spell protections but they cant. It makes enemy mages virtually useless. These items should be able to be breached by the normal magic spells that would breach their protections (ruby ray of reversal etc.) but should then reactivate after a set period of time, say after you rest. Well, at least in ToB they made the cloak stop REFLECTING the magic, it merely stops it...my god that was just too sick...especially with beholders. It was just a masacre.

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"Not everything ends the way you think it should"

Mages are not as good in ToB due to fighters can breakup stoneskin easily with their cool whirlwind attacks. But nevertheless they are the best class(power game) that is!

Who cares about Protection from magic scrolls??? There are defensive spells to cast on yourself, let some summons out and/or cast some fightingspell (Tensers or Rightous Magic or something like that).

Tenser's Transformation

Mages RULE!!!!!

A high level mage will still die bloody quick if a high level thief backstabs him unexpectedly because none of his contingency spells will go off. If there is poison on the weapon it gets messy very quickly.

That is NOT to say the thief is more powerful than the mage however.

In BG2 you are right a high level mage is probably 'invincible' against other character classes but the same does not apply with PnP-you have to sleep, you run out of spells, you run out of contingencies, spell triggers, you drink poison etc etc.

A high level single mage on his own still cannot handle every situation though he needs support, just try walking him through a thieves guild for example.

Assuming he manages to avoid all the traps, he'll be getting constantly backstabbed and poison darted, eventually his protection spells will run out and he's a dead man. (Of course the same applies to the thief stupid enough to try and break into a school of sorcery or the like)

Generally you can argue that any character class meeting any other class under favourable circumstances can beat any other but to my mind the class that will do most of the winning-assuming he has his spells of course is the mage.

It also comes down to level at high level the mage will win but at lower levels the fighter, cleric or even the thief (backstab remember) is a better bet.

Ultimately its all down to how you play-if you play like a fool it does not matter what class you play you'll die-period.

Wizards are cool, but if they are out of spells...

Heh the mage being out of spells argument is like the fighter being out of hps argument. I mean to a mage hps are irrelevent right? who cares about your hps. Without your spells you are like a little bunnie rabbit. but to a fighter hps are everything. you need them to go on. so saying a mage will run out of spells eventually is pretty silly IMHO. If your mage is out of spells he has already kicked some butt!

Anyways the mage might not be the do everything class but the stuff mages do they do more impressively than any other class I think. you just can't compete with the insane abilities of simulcrum,contingencies,time stop,project image. Staff of magi is a free invis whenever they want it. Plus a mage can adapt to any situation. there are scrolls or spells to defend yourself against any enemy and there is spells to tear down any warriors protections. As some previous poster mentioned backstab is a nice way to take out a mage quickly although thats assuming the mage doesn't have defensive spells up in the first place...
Tensers transformation I like but only on fights where I know what I stand. Otherwise I would rather have my mage spells available to me so that I can adapt to the situation as it unfolds.

Now this is what makes the mage so groovy. There is a spell for, almost, every encounter and situation. To be able to backstab, a thief must be invisible. Now, is there a spell called...uhm...true..sight...??? =). Anyway, I did go through the thieves guild with a solo mage/cleric (multiclass). Now PnP is not the same as computergames, very true. Since a DM(?) would probably not even allow a mage to get to level 20+, and could always come up with a situation or encounter where the mage would stand no chance. And that would make it difficult, in PnP. In CRPG, of course he will run out of spells in time, if he does not have WISH(!) =) and so can memorize all spells again without sleeping. Damn! I just got the feeling I want to play a highlevel mage solo through BG2!! =)

A minor point admittedly but the mage has to be expecting an invisible opponent to want to cast true sight. The thief (if he had any sense) will just saunter up behind the mage without warning and knife him. Result dead mage.

But you're right in pnp you don't know what is going to happen next. in BG2 if you've completed the game once you do-it makes a huge difference to your style of play.

That is why Neverwinter Nights online is going to be so good.You'll really have to cooperate with each other...

I still prefer mages to other classes I'm currently playing a sorceror he's 12th leveland just about to start the Umar Hills quest...