Well, WMD situation was a sales position, nothing more. The real causes of those planning the removal will likely be unknown. What they feel personally is of no importance.

It would be rather crass to call me a conspiracy theorist, as I'm more preoccupied with other things. What's more, just because it hasn't happened doesn't mean it won't happen. If the notion of people being inherently evil is sound (which would raise serious questions about depending upon a government full of those evil people for anything, or wanting to do business with them) or if Australians aren't somehow superhuman (though you made it sound like your culture was one where violence and bad things plain don't happen) I'm going to say your country is just as much open to the windfall of evil conspiracy (remember, in that particular debate, I shrunk it to 2 people, not hard to find two evil people anywhere, much less 2 evil people who network a little) and good conspiracy.

My perspective in that discussion wasn't uniquely American, and Australia's situation wasn't uniquely non-American.

Also, for the record,

Moore has not responded to the serious criticisms levelled against Bowling For Columbine, and he's been not responding to those criticisms for two years.

Here's a short interview with Michael Moore done by someone of conservative ilk (or that's what I suspect) - Moore's got some interesting things to say, even encourages conservatives to make their own documentary-style editorials. Worth watching.

http://brain-terminal.com/video/mich...icktime-hq.php

[ 06-01-2004, 04:53 PM: Message edited by: Grojlach ]

Heh heh, oooooh, philosophy sneaks in, excellent!
I'd say that people are inherently people. And that they invent their own notions of good and evil and apply them to the world as they see fit. Religious doctine is also choice. So, for example, the Catholic chooses to believe the Catholic notion of original sin; that all people just subconsciously evil and need to consciously follow the bible scriptures and church officials in order to save themselves from themselves, which I choose to interpret as bollocks [img]smile.gif[/img] It's all just human choice [img]smile.gif[/img]

---off-topic rant over---

Yeah, Dave Hardy is working on it at this time... Lack of funding though... The vast right wing conspiracy isn't very concerned...

To The Heirophant -- My point was, if everyone is looking to screw you over, and apparently the corporate world is doing this at all times, why should there be a large and powerful group of mugs looking to do the same, with legal power and authority to do so, with little or no accountability whatsoever?

[ 06-01-2004, 05:13 PM: Message edited by: Oblivion437 ]

Sure, you bring your spinsters, I'll bring mine. Moore is just a Rush Limbaugh working for the other side -- hefty, annoying, lying, pig-headed, and respected by the wingnuts. Moore should try his hand at Radio, and Rush should try a documentary.

[quote]Originally posted by Oblivion437:

Quote:

Originally posted by Yorick: Australians aren't somehow superhuman (though you made it sound like your culture was one where violence and bad things plain don't happen) I'm going to say your country is just as much open to the windfall of evil conspiracy

Until you go and visit the place and see for yourself, your words are a waste of energy.

NB. Many Americans have moved to Australia purely because of the low crime rate.

Again, get out of your country and see for yourself things are very different beyond it's borders.

Crass is often a label levelled at Australians by British and Americans, so I'm fine with that. "Blunt" is another way of putting it. You are a conspiracy theorist. You give credence and weight to conspiracy theories, and publically support these ideas. May as well call a spade a spade. No use beating around the Bush.

On a positive note for Aussies, an Australian Ms. Universe was crowned tonight, and if this blonde beaut is indicative of the whole of the island, I'm packing my bags tonight! [img]graemlins/heee.gif[/img]

<font color=deepskyblue>Gosh, I must have missed the last few "documentary films" put out by FOX NEWS.

While it's true that Faux News presents itself as "Fair and Balanced", nobody believes that any more than they believe Pro Wrestling is real. Even most hardcore conservatives will admit to the obvious slant Fox puts on their news.
</font> </font>[/QUOTE]I think you're overestimating the intelligence level of Average Joe here...
Face it, in every single country in the world, a majority of the populace don't really care about politics and purely base their opinions on what little they read in the paper or see on tv. And when they're suddenly goaded into having an opinion, they stick with what little they know or are easily impressionable by whatever the next charismatic moron tells them to be the truth. Call me cynical or whatever (I know I am), but the media influence should never be underestimated, however silly its output may look to people who *do* take the trouble of staying well-informed.