You still like him though, right? :D </font>[/QUOTE]I never said that. :D I think he's a fine person, but not fit to lead. I think his administration is successful because he has done what any cagey businessman who knows they're in over their heads does: surrounded himself with really competent people. He's doing fine with Iraq, even if he is a bit overzealous, but you cannot address only one issue at a time. I've seen nothing real on the economy in over a year to even be suggested by his office.

That's really an easy answer TL because it makes it seems like having good people on the team is a cop-out or an admission of incompetence. Furthermore, it makes it too simple to say anything good that happens isn't his idea, and everything bad is completely his fault. ;)

I will point out that any competant president would surround himself with the best and brightest he could find. Wouldn't it be stupid to say, I'm the smartest, so hire a bunch of jackasses as advisors? :D

I just wish they enforced them against Israel,
It has more outstanding resolutions than Iraq.

None that force them to disarm or submit to UN inspections though.

EDIT - And what exactly does that have to do with the point being made, the issues being discussed, or the topic of this thread? If you want to start an anti-Israel thread you could. ;)

[ 11-21-2002, 02:30 PM: Message edited by: Ronn_Bman ]

Ronn, My post regarding the Bush Team was not an all-or-nothing comment. I'm just saying that I think his exceptional team is his saving grace. I think his personal aptitude is best evidenced by the fact that he has not had a press conference since 9/11/01. He's made speeches, but has little ability to field questions. Take notice of this, and let me know if I'm wrong.

I know TL. [img]smile.gif[/img]

But even saying they're his saving grace is too easy because there is no way to prove or disprove it. We can't just bench "the team" to find out, and the fact that he doesn't give speaches doesn't prove it to me.

You'll never hear me argue that he's a great orator . [img]graemlins/hehe.gif[/img]

Kind of like the argument over his college transcripts. He's not a genius, but he's competent. Personally, I'd rather have a president who can pick and then actually administrate his administration than one who sounds good and can put on a show for the press and public. Both would be nice, but if I have to choose...

I do realize your arguments go deeper than this though, and your point is taken. ;)

[ 11-21-2002, 02:57 PM: Message edited by: Ronn_Bman ]

<font color="#ff6666">Im not posting about the content of the article, but asking a question.

Why does ANYONE care what a failed presidential campaign, ex-politician, unemployed, out of touch, out of the loop person like this guy says?

He has no idea what is or is not being done, he has no inside skinny on the security briefs from NSA and other three letter acronyms. Basicly he is no more or less informed than anyone on here? He may one day hold an office again, but right now he is nobody as far as foreign policy goes.

</font>

True Magik, but what he says is important because, to the American public, he's the most likely Democratic presidental candidate for '04, so what he has to say about these things has to be regarded as important although for the most part it's rhetoric.

This is part of his election run "wind up", and not everyone realizes he doesn't know as much about the situation as he'd like us to believe, and unfortunately this allows him to spread misinformation.

<font color="#ff6666">Do you really think that he will be the best that the democrats can find for the 04 elections? I was expecting Daschel or someone, not gore who by then will be so hopelessly out of the loop that it would be like having a completely new guy. I don't mean to dis the guy, but he really is out of the loop and uninformed to the point that he really doesnt know anymore than the average internet aware google user.</font>

Ronn and MagiK, before you guys get too busy carried away with stoking each other's flames, let's not forget: (1) this guy was privy to US secrets for 8 years, (2) The DNC likely doesn't deny him any info he wants, (3) Contacts exist for all of us in our chosen profession, and (4) one could reasonably assume he's at least as up-to-date as the most up-to-date people on this pages because keeping up with these trends is both his job and, yes, his passion (as with most politicians). If you're saying "Let's be real, here," I am merely agreeing and trying to help you do so.

[ 11-21-2002, 03:49 PM: Message edited by: Timber Loftis ]