Every time someone tell you a way by wich a mage could win, you say it does not count, and fighter can't even use scrolls, so lets just save time and ask the REAL question:

Who would win in a Melee fight Between a Fighter and a Mage?

The Fighter would win, happy now?

I think you misunderstood me Luvian, i didn't say imprisonment didn't count, i just said it was overpowered and about your question from fighter-mage in melee, i'm not that sure: mirror image, stoneskin, blur,..., tenser's transformation makes one hell of a tank

It just seem to me that you are biased to the fighter, since you rule out time stop and consider imprisonement overpowered, but you don't mind the fighter using a protection from magic scroll (wich make the fighter immune to ALL magic).

Ok, i didn't know that prot from magic is used against all magic, i just thought it was used to do away with magic damage like skull trap and ADHW, but i thought that you could still launch a fireball or a flame arrow or something like that, sorry my bad, and it's not because you think something is overpowered that you can't use it, but with time stop, the fighter wouldn't even have the chance to do something, the mage could just like: cast time stop, ABHW, time stop, ABHw, time stop,... until he's out of timestops, but against that time the fighter is long history.

Wouldn't it depend on the type of fighter - wizard slayer kit is pretty useful - and the type of cloak, weapon, armour, boots, belt and necklace etc... that he/she is using.

A ring of invisibility would negate the imprisonment spell - you cannot imprison that which you cannot see. Or an enraged beserker... I don't think you can imprison somebody who's "enraged".

Time stop could be a show stopper but only if the mage can get it off in time.

Might come down to who gets the first "shot" off.

But the wizard has a counter for pretty much everything the fighter can do. Most divination spells will undo the ring of invisibilty. At level 40, LMR would take you down 50% MR - stick two of those in a spell trigger with Greater Mal - now the warrior's open to anything. A well-prepared (chain) contingency and the warrior can't get a word in edgewise. Without Time Stop the fighter might break through the defenses with sheer number of blows, but I'd still have my money on the wizard (though a 40th level Kensai with two blackrazors and two Gaxx rings was quite the killing machine).

Now, in a Gibberling killing contest (something woefully lacking from SoA), I vote for the fighter. The wizard has to run out of spells eventually! [img]tongue.gif[/img]

You say that when using a wizard slayer, it would also depend on which cloak, bracers, rings, amulets, ...., but a wizard slayer can't use any items like that (AFAIK), he can only use magical armor and weaponry, at least, that's what the kit description says.

Stone skin does not even take a second to cast. It is impossible the fighter can get close enough to the mage before he cast it. Once it is casted it give the mage enough time to finish the warrior.

AD&D is designed for high level mages to be the most powerful character class in the game.

However, high level fighters can eat a LOT of damage the mage deals out.

It would really depend on what items each character had and who got initiative.

I happen to play a Wizard Slayer, and they are darned effective against spellcasters. In addition to the their Magic Resistance, they have a 10% (cumulative chance) per hit to cause Miscast Magic. At 40th level, a Hasted fighter with Mastery or better will have 5 attacks/round. Even if they don't cause Miscast, they stand a GOOD chance of disrupting the spellcasting.

You are correct that Wizard Slayers can only use Armor and Weapons. NO cloaks, rings, girdles, etc. However, they CAN use boots and guantlets.

I've downloaded a couple of items from outside the game that give me some extra advantages.

Charon's Gauntlets - automatically TURNS any spell 6th level or below back onto the caster (except for Area of Effect spells, like Fireball).

Bala's Axe - Imported from BGI. It also has a 10% chance per hit to cause Miscast Magic.

Riftsword - Gives Protection from Magic. Plus, each hit drains one spell from mage's memory.

And if all else fails....

Sihn's Soulreaver - 75% chance PER hit that the target must Save vs Death or die.

I would put Cerek up against any wizard, but even with all my special abilities and weapons going for me, a couple of Time Stops will completely ruin my day.

So..to answer the question...the Law of Averages favors the mage. He will probably win 60%-70% of the time, but the fighter has pretty decent odds too.

Lots of those items are overpowered. No sane DM would allow them in his campain, but then again, those where not made by sane DMs.