Eh? I am having trouble.. er, wording that.

As for the strongest servant, I agree with Attalus in that the Lord of the Naz'gul is Sauron's most powerful and favoured servant. Keep in mind that he was originally a powerful sorceror king and had many victories before his fall. When Sauron was out of the picture during the third age, it was the LotN that rose up and destroyed the north kingdom as the Witch King of Angmar. It was the LotN that captured Minas Ithil and turned it into the tower of wraiths. At every point where S was predisposed, it was he who assumed control, not the Mouth of Sauron.

Yepp my thoughts exactly. I just threw it in there for the sake of it. ;)

I wonder if you can count Saruman as a servant of Sauron. Sure he did do what Sauron told him to, but he was using another agenda than Sauron was. ;)

<font color="yellow">
Well I too think that Lord Nazgul was the most powerful servant.But judging from Silmarillion it could be Lord Of Balrogs(forgot his name)...
Cheers [img]smile.gif[/img]
Xen
</font>

[ 03-01-2003, 04:15 PM: Message edited by: Xen ]

You are thinking about Gothmog. But he was not Sauron´s servant and it could probably be argued that he was more powerful than Sauron himself (they were both Maiar). He was a servant of Morgoth though.

<font color="gold">Aye, this I agree with. Gothmog probably was stronger than Sauron, becuase if it were the opposite, I believe Sauron would be looked on as a threat much long before he was.

Now that we're on that subject, who do you think was the strongest of Morgoth's servants? Or, what I'm really asking, who do you think were the strongest of Gothmog and Glaurung? For those of you who don't know, Glaurung was the first dragon. ;) </font>

Now this could turn into an interesting debate...

In the blue corner, weighing in at- well, Eru only knows, we have Gothmog, Maiar spirit of fire, Lord of the Balrogs, High Captain of Angband and chief lieutenant of Melkor. Armed with a standard issue flaming whip and mighty black battle axe, Gothmog is a fearsome fighting machine. Even a rough estimate of the numbers of elves and men he has slain is beyond comprehension. What is known is that he has slain two High Kings of the Noldor** and has been at the forefront of every major offensive in the War of the Jewels.

** Feanor (Curufinwe, most gifted and arrogant of all the elves) was perhaps Gothmog's greatest victory. He was mortally wounded shortly after the Battle Under Stars. His nephew, Fingon, was cleaved by Gothmog's axe during the Battle of Unnumbered Tears. At the time of their deaths, both held the title of High King.

In the red corner, weighing in at something considerably heavier than Gothmog, we have Glaurung the Golden, Father of Dragons, first and greatest of the Uruloki. Bred by Melkor in the pits of Angband, (which, in comparison to Gothmog, would make him mortal!!) Glaurung has been the Dark Lord's not-so-secret special weapon since the year 260 of the first age. Armed with generic fire breath and arcane powers, he single handedly destroyed the entire Elf realm of Nargothrond and blighted the lives of several important figures during the War of the Jewels (if you don't know who/how, then i won't spoil you! ;) ) As with Gothmog, exact numbers of slayings are indeterminate. The Dwarven King Azaghal is the only significant individual to have been killed by Glaurung directly.

Who would win?..

I'm afraid that's one for the Tolkienologists. Gothmog appears to have been incredibly reliable in every task his master has set for him. His Maiar heritage would no doubt have provided him with significant powers and godly abilities but at no time do these gifts show themselves except when manifested in combat. I've yet to come across any writings that give even the smallest insight into his thoughts and motivations. To the observer, he may well be a brainless servant solely at the whim of Melkor, though his Maiar status does suggest otherwise.

Glaurung on the other hand, is definately not brainless. It's not hard to see what the modern depiction of the fantasy dragon evolved from. A hideously cunning, malicious mind capable of evil schemes of almost unmatched complexity. Add to that a powerful physical form with incendiary breath (useless on Gothmog though) and you clearly have a being of the highest tier of mortals. Every D&D fantasy depiction of a dragon owes something to Tolkien's impression.

IMO, a physical confrontation between the two would see Gothmog emerge as the victor. Classicly speaking however, a straight up battle between two evil creatures on the same team just doesn't happen. Especially when they are as powerful as these. Something akin to a cold war would be the more likely occurence. (Ok, so one's a spirit of fire and other's a fire breathing dragon - a pretty warm cold war!) In a situation like this Glaurung, with his mind spells and downright nasty cunning, would clearly have the upper hand.