Confirmed by who? Not Colin Powell and not the Military and DoD spokepeople. All have stated in the recent past that it is hard to determine exactly who, why, and how many of each are fighting against us. Some are terrorists, some are tribalists, some are nationalists and others are part of militias like Sadr's group, ect. Certainly there seem to be plenty of terrorists, but plenty doesn't equal most. So if you have a fact nugget that confirms your assertion of confirmation I'll appreciate it.

watch the news, chewie.

every time you see a death list with civilians on it, where the attack was intentionally made in a public place just for that purpose, thats a terrorist attack. every time you see a civilian target (ie, iraqi oil pipelines) attacked, thats terrorism. attacking the US embassy is terrorism. i think you'll find that the ratio of insurectionist attacks (attacks on military targets with no intended civilian casualties) to terrorist attacks is quite low.

second, i dont care what you call them (tribalists, nationalists, and what not-- i won't title them militia, becuase they don't fit that definition). they are still insurectionists and are still using methods which are against the internation laws of warfare. you can justify supporting insurrectionists if you want, but it doesnt make a difference. Insurectionists and terrorists are both illegal and wrong.

Happy to oblige. Put up or shut up. I simply want those who really do support the terrorists shown the door from this forum. If you don't support attacking civilians and you don't support action against the US, you don't. If you do support those actions, and you do support the actions against the US, its civilians, and Iraqi civilians, I want you shown to the door ... or I want to call you out for what you are. It's as simple as that. See if I give a flying shit for those opposing my title. While made in haste and with little thought (I admit!) it has nevertheless sparked a great debate on IWF. Do we really want those who take joy in seeing US troops die posting here? Do we really want those who think the terrorists have a point and a good way of exercising it posting here? I submit that we do not. If you think the war in Iraq has flaws, kudos to you and I respect that opinion. But if you think it is good that the terrorists may be gaining ground against the US, ■■■■ YOU, I say.

[ 06-23-2004, 02:20 AM: Message edited by: Timber Loftis ]

All you had to do is say so. God, I hate feeling like the new J. McCarthy, whom I despise.

All you had to do is say so. God, I hate feeling like the new J. McCarthy, whom I despise. </font>[/QUOTE]Why exactly did I have to say it in the first place? I have never expressed anything but saddness and outrage whenever terrorists attack and whenever innocent lives and greivous injuries are caused by violence and I have never cheered or supported attacks on coaltion troops, my own or any other nation.

Look I dont want to beat a dead horse, but I would greatly care to understand more where you are coming from. My approach before was flawed, I attacked your position but did not really try to understand it at all.

P.S. would you consider an edit to your previous post? I would hate to see you get sent on involuntary vacation for an f-bomb. I understand the principle of the matter, so if you decide to let it stand, I dont object myself but personally would hate to see you get sent away over a mere word when you offer alot of perspective to the forum.

Happy to oblige. Put up or shut up. I simply want those who really do support the terrorists shown the door from this forum. If you don't support attacking civilians and you don't support action against the US, you don't. If you do support those actions, and you do support the actions against the US, its civilians, and Iraqi civilians, I want you shown to the door ... or I want to call you out for what you are. It's as simple as that. See if I give a flying shit for those opposing my title. While made in haste and with little thought (I admit!) it has nevertheless sparked a great debate on IWF. Do we really want those who take joy in seeing US troops die posting here? Do we really want those who think the terrorists have a point and a good way of exercising it posting here? I submit that we do not. If you think the war in Iraq has flaws, kudos to you and I respect that opinion. <font color="red">But if you think it is good that the terrorists may be gaining ground against the US, ■■■■ YOU, I say. </font></font>[/QUOTE]No you won't be saying that mate. I support your anti-terrorist viewpoint totally, though I am concerned at your efforts to put everyone in this forum in a FOR or AGAINST box, but at the end of the day you can think however you like and that doesn't concern me. We allowed you to have this provocative title for your thread because you haven't actually named anyone here a terrorist supporter (and I suggest you keep your mouth shut on that front).

But unfortunately you've shot yourself in the foot mate. The entire tone of your post, ranting on and on against these imagined "terrorist supporters" on this forum (jeez, don't you think we'd be doing something if there were open terrorist supporters on this forum? http://www.kiwirugby.net/krforums/im...n_question.gif) is disturbing enough, but that's your thought process. But you've been told as everyone here has been that this type of foul language is not allowed here. You yourself said on that thread that you expect to be suspended in short order because you don't find anything wrong with swearing and it's a staple of your life. Well, personally I don't either - but I don't like hearing/reading swear words every post. If you guys had been sensible with your choice of speech and only used cuss words for effect and did so infrequently we wouldn't even have this rule in place. But the bottom line is for whatever reason the rule is now in place, like it or not, and we all have to abide by it, like it or not, and I have to enforce it, like it or not. You can't say you weren't told about this. Of all the things you can get suspended on Timber, this is a pretty silly thing to get suspended on, really, as it's so avoidable.

You'll be taking a break from here, mate. I'll recommend to Z that it be for less than a month, but it's his call in the end. If you find that you are unable to drop the habit of using cuss words and restrain yourself while you're here and so decide that you can't be here anymore because you can't post without swearing (as you said previously), then that would be very unfortunate, as you add a lot of value to this forum in particular (when you're calm and cool). I would be surprised if you really couldn't show the self-control required to do restrain yourself, as this shouldn't be a hard thing. But that's up to you, really. Cheers. [img]smile.gif[/img]

[ 06-23-2004, 11:27 AM: Message edited by: Memnoch ]

Happy to oblige. Put up or shut up. I simply want those who really do support the terrorists shown the door from this forum. If you don't support attacking civilians and you don't support action against the US, you don't. If you do support those actions, and you do support the actions against the US, its civilians, and Iraqi civilians, I want you shown to the door ... or I want to call you out for what you are. It's as simple as that. See if I give a flying shit for those opposing my title. While made in haste and with little thought (I admit!) it has nevertheless sparked a great debate on IWF. Do we really want those who take joy in seeing US troops die posting here? Do we really want those who think the terrorists have a point and a good way of exercising it posting here? I submit that we do not. If you think the war in Iraq has flaws, kudos to you and I respect that opinion. But if you think it is good that the terrorists may be gaining ground against the US, ■■■■ YOU, I say. </font>[/QUOTE]I tell you what Timber, why don't you stop your bad language and name a few names, as you say no one wants to see pro terrorist posters here, so why not name your suspects and do us all a favour, and please remember when you post that it's not all about America, there's plenty of other nations with troops in Iraq, and their homelands are at risk from these people too!!

So come on, who do you think they are.

[ 06-23-2004, 04:54 AM: Message edited by: Lanesra ]

You know the amusing thing though Majik? I took out "anti-US/anti-Coalition" from your post above and replaced it with a blank line...not to suggest that your comments don't have merit - I'm sure they do - but that people who hold alternative views are also justified in using that exact line above to air how they feel about things they've seen/read here.

I guess what I'm trying to say is that despite the different viewpoints you all hold, this is one thing you all have in common - you're all singing from the same hymn sheet when it comes to feeling goaded, provoked and persecuted. That's why I think that when things get heated you should all just chill out and not take what you post/read too seriously. [img]smile.gif[/img]

<font face="COMIC Sans MS" size="3" color="#7c9bc4">
Memnoch I wasn't trying to push an agenda just make an explanation.

I would contend that some goad more than others, but hell I might be considered the biggest goader of all King Goader in fact....Can I have a crown? Ok seriously I have been silent and observed for quite a while and I have to tell you....it seemed to me that it was conservatives christians, pro-Bush, pro-Iraq action, people that were the ones under the biggest assault .....Thats what I got out of several months of observation only. (no I wasnt hear every day but I did look in now and then)

Yeah we may all feel goaded, but I still think some have more claim to it than others....just my [img]graemlins/2cents.gif[/img] </font>